What is consciousness?
- divine focus
- Posts: 611
- Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2007 1:48 pm
What is consciousness?
When you hear the word "consciousness," what does it mean to you?
To me, it is everything that exists. Consciousness is what we are and what everything around us is made of. We project ourselves as the world and experience being in a world. Consciousness is the ultimate and absolute, and to realize it you need to drop yourself.
To me, it is everything that exists. Consciousness is what we are and what everything around us is made of. We project ourselves as the world and experience being in a world. Consciousness is the ultimate and absolute, and to realize it you need to drop yourself.
eliasforum.org/digests.html
Re: What is consciousness?
In other words, consciousness is another word you use for the thing-in-itself? That could get confusing in general conversation.divine focus wrote:To me, it is everything that exists. Consciousness is what we are and what everything around us is made of. We project ourselves as the world and experience being in a world. Consciousness is the ultimate and absolute, and to realize it you need to drop yourself.
I try to stick with the common definitions of words unless there's some reason to change them, so consciousness is that elusive thing that we also refer to as the state of self-awareness.
- Diebert van Rhijn
- Posts: 6469
- Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 4:43 pm
Re: What is consciousness?
At heart the ego is to the ego "everything that exists". It's ego which thinks the world is himself and there's nothing else. Ego is greedy like that! Ego projects itself as the world -- all revolving around itself. Its core function is t̶o̶ ̶d̶e̶n̶y̶ ̶i̶t̶ ̶d̶o̶e̶s̶n̶'̶t̶ ̶e̶x̶i̶s̶t̶,̶ ̶t̶o̶ ̶h̶i̶d̶e̶ ̶f̶o̶r̶ ̶i̶t̶s̶e̶l̶f̶ to hide that's it, at best, appears as aggregate function, as consciousness (which is not by definition). To establish such false ego paradise all critical thought and examination has to be let go and be replaced by something harmless to it. Cushy pillows for example! Deep down the doubts eat away and fuel the violence against truth.divine focus wrote:To me, it is everything that exists. Consciousness is what we are and what everything around us is made of. We project ourselves as the world and experience being in a world. Consciousness is the ultimate and absolute, and to realize it you need to drop yourself.
-
- Posts: 3851
- Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 4:12 pm
- Location: Flippen-well AUSTRALIA
Re: What is consciousness?
Really? All that from a sound? What does a sound signify?divine focus wrote:When you hear the word "consciousness," what does it mean to you?
To me, it is everything that exists. Consciousness is what we are and what everything around us is made of. We project ourselves as the world and experience being in a world.
Drop?Consciousness is the ultimate and absolute, and to realize it you need to drop yourself.
Between Suicides
-
- Posts: 3851
- Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 4:12 pm
- Location: Flippen-well AUSTRALIA
Re: What is consciousness?
Lol[Ego's] core function is to deny it doesn't exist,[...]
Jesus fucking christ...
Between Suicides
- Diebert van Rhijn
- Posts: 6469
- Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 4:43 pm
Re: What is consciousness?
Pretty bad sentence indeed and I removed the convolution.
- divine focus
- Posts: 611
- Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2007 1:48 pm
Re: What is consciousness?
Ego really is just conscious will and judgment. Without it, it is just the subjective self (spirit) willing everything without judgment (right and wrong, good and bad).Diebert van Rhijn wrote:At heart the ego is to the ego "everything that exists". It's ego which thinks the world is himself and there's nothing else. Ego is greedy like that! Ego projects itself as the world -- all revolving around itself. Its core function is t̶o̶ ̶d̶e̶n̶y̶ ̶i̶t̶ ̶d̶o̶e̶s̶n̶'̶t̶ ̶e̶x̶i̶s̶t̶,̶ ̶t̶o̶ ̶h̶i̶d̶e̶ ̶f̶o̶r̶ ̶i̶t̶s̶e̶l̶f̶ to hide that's it, at best, appears as aggregate function, as consciousness (which is not by definition). To establish such false ego paradise all critical thought and examination has to be let go and be replaced by something harmless to it. Cushy pillows for example! Deep down the doubts eat away and fuel the violence against truth.
All your attention (ideally) revolves around yourself; it is the natural way. You can't trust yourself--and therefore let go of control--if you are only paying attention to what is other than you.
eliasforum.org/digests.html
- divine focus
- Posts: 611
- Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2007 1:48 pm
Re: What is consciousness?
"Hear", "see", same difference.Leyla Shen wrote:Really? All that from a sound? What does a sound signify?divine focus wrote:When you hear the word "consciousness," what does it mean to you?
To me, it is everything that exists. Consciousness is what we are and what everything around us is made of. We project ourselves as the world and experience being in a world.
Drop the mental image of yourself. You see yourself as a person, but you're really all that is. You need to dis-identify from the definitions of self relating to society. "I am so and so's daughter or mother, for example.Drop?Consciousness is the ultimate and absolute, and to realize it you need to drop yourself.
eliasforum.org/digests.html
- divine focus
- Posts: 611
- Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2007 1:48 pm
Re: What is consciousness?
Common definition? In what culture?RZoo wrote:In other words, consciousness is another word you use for the thing-in-itself? That could get confusing in general conversation.divine focus wrote:To me, it is everything that exists. Consciousness is what we are and what everything around us is made of. We project ourselves as the world and experience being in a world. Consciousness is the ultimate and absolute, and to realize it you need to drop yourself.
I try to stick with the common definitions of words unless there's some reason to change them, so consciousness is that elusive thing that we also refer to as the state of self-awareness.
You could say the same thing about "thing in itself." I think "consciousness" is a better word because it identifies you as the absolute. It helps to rectify the materialistic view of the world as other and separate from you. This view is refuted by discoveries at the forefront of science, although they are not being allowed to become mainstream just yet.
eliasforum.org/digests.html
-
- Posts: 3851
- Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 4:12 pm
- Location: Flippen-well AUSTRALIA
Re: What is consciousness?
(This is exactly why I have nothing to do with clairvoyants and psychologists.)Drop the mental image of yourself. You see yourself as a person, but you're really all that is. You need to dis-identify from the definitions of self relating to society. "I am so and so's daughter or mother, for example.
Being so-and-so's daughter or mother, for example, is the last thing on my mind except in circumstances when such an identification is required on the part of others. You?
Between Suicides
-
- Posts: 3851
- Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 4:12 pm
- Location: Flippen-well AUSTRALIA
Re: What is consciousness?
Moreover, it would be sensible (if you value such a thing) to make clear distinctions between the "you" doing the dropping and the "you" being dropped.
Between Suicides
Re: What is consciousness?
Any culture that uses the English language.divine focus wrote:Common definition? In what culture?RZoo wrote:In other words, consciousness is another word you use for the thing-in-itself? That could get confusing in general conversation.divine focus wrote:To me, it is everything that exists. Consciousness is what we are and what everything around us is made of. We project ourselves as the world and experience being in a world. Consciousness is the ultimate and absolute, and to realize it you need to drop yourself.
I try to stick with the common definitions of words unless there's some reason to change them, so consciousness is that elusive thing that we also refer to as the state of self-awareness.
You can't say the same because "thing-in-itself" doesn't have any other meaning that you're trampling.divine focus wrote:You could say the same thing about "thing in itself."
How do you know that you're absolute? What's the alternative to being absolute? And how do you know you aren't that instead? (Oh damn, this again?)divine focus wrote:I think "consciousness" is a better word because it identifies you as the absolute.
The value of words is to unify and provide meaningful discussion on a common basis. We should be striving for mutual understanding and clarify, rather than redefining words willy-nilly as suits us; that only generates extra confusion on an already extremely vague and confusing subject matter.
- divine focus
- Posts: 611
- Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2007 1:48 pm
Re: What is consciousness?
It's never on my mind. You are not the norm if that's the case for you. Identification with social roles limits you to personhood and creates separation where there need be none.Leyla Shen wrote:(This is exactly why I have nothing to do with clairvoyants and psychologists.)Drop the mental image of yourself. You see yourself as a person, but you're really all that is. You need to dis-identify from the definitions of self relating to society. "I am so and so's daughter or mother, for example.
Being so-and-so's daughter or mother, for example, is the last thing on my mind except in circumstances when such an identification is required on the part of others. You?
There's also the issue of the whole of society being in your head in the form of authorities of one kind or another. You may notice that you can't function in relation to others without some influence on your thinking of someone you took to be an authority at one point. This was the case for me many years ago.
eliasforum.org/digests.html
- divine focus
- Posts: 611
- Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2007 1:48 pm
Re: What is consciousness?
Why not redefine words? The meaning of words don't stay the same for all of eternity. As we learn new things about ourselves and our world, it may make sense for a word to change its definition instead of just falling to the wayside in disuse.RZoo wrote:How do you know that you're absolute? What's the alternative to being absolute? And how do you know you aren't that instead? (Oh damn, this again?)divine focus wrote:I think "consciousness" is a better word because it identifies you as the absolute.
The value of words is to unify and provide meaningful discussion on a common basis. We should be striving for mutual understanding and clarify, rather than redefining words willy-nilly as suits us; that only generates extra confusion on an already extremely vague and confusing subject matter.
eliasforum.org/digests.html
Re: What is consciousness?
The word consciousness is not at risk of falling to the wayside from disuse. Redefining words to enhance clarity and meaning is one thing, but redefining them for the opposite effect is another. I guess that sort of thing passes for "wisdom" and "genius" in some circles where it's desirable to be as vague and obscure as possible.
Re: What is consciousness?
What isn't consciousness?divine focus wrote:What is consciousness?
a gutter rat looking at stars
-
- Posts: 2619
- Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 10:40 pm
Re: What is consciousness?
To be conscious is to be conscious of something, which is?
-
- Posts: 3851
- Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 4:12 pm
- Location: Flippen-well AUSTRALIA
Re: What is consciousness?
So to solve the problem, you simply identify yourself as "the absolute".divine focus wrote:It's never on my mind. You are not the norm if that's the case for you. Identification with social roles limits you to personhood and creates separation where there need be none.Leyla Shen wrote:(This is exactly why I have nothing to do with clairvoyants and psychologists.)Drop the mental image of yourself. You see yourself as a person, but you're really all that is. You need to dis-identify from the definitions of self relating to society. "I am so and so's daughter or mother, for example.
Being so-and-so's daughter or mother, for example, is the last thing on my mind except in circumstances when such an identification is required on the part of others. You?
There's also the issue of the whole of society being in your head in the form of authorities of one kind or another. You may notice that you can't function in relation to others without some influence on your thinking of someone you took to be an authority at one point. This was the case for me many years ago.
Do you never call your mum "Mum" because it would be out of character with what you have identified yourself with?
Between Suicides
Re: What is consciousness?
Self consciousmovingalways wrote:To be conscious is to be conscious of something, which is?
a gutter rat looking at stars
Re: What is consciousness?
What if the you doing the dropping is chained to the you being dropped?Leyla Shen wrote:Moreover, it would be sensible (if you value such a thing) to make clear distinctions between the "you" doing the dropping and the "you" being dropped.
a gutter rat looking at stars
- divine focus
- Posts: 611
- Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2007 1:48 pm
Re: What is consciousness?
Yes. The knowledge of myself as consciousness came about as a result of "inquiry" in line with traditional advaita vedanta, where you apply the knowledge of vedanta to your mind repeatedly (jnana yoga).Leyla Shen wrote:So to solve the problem, you simply identify yourself as "the absolute".divine focus wrote:It's never on my mind. You are not the norm if that's the case for you. Identification with social roles limits you to personhood and creates separation where there need be none.
There's also the issue of the whole of society being in your head in the form of authorities of one kind or another. You may notice that you can't function in relation to others without some influence on your thinking of someone you took to be an authority at one point. This was the case for me many years ago.
The social roles are still there, so yes, I do call my mom "mom." Good question. It's more like I'm aware of how others perceive me, much like how you said you operate, except there's no identification with the role. It's just an idea in the mind.Do you never call your mum "Mum" because it would be out of character with what you have identified yourself with?
eliasforum.org/digests.html
-
- Posts: 3851
- Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 4:12 pm
- Location: Flippen-well AUSTRALIA
Re: What is consciousness?
Just an idea in the mind? Am I to conclude from this that you take no part in society, and society has no part in you?The social roles are still there, so yes, I do call my mom "mom." Good question. It's more like I'm aware of how others perceive me, much like how you said you operate, except there's no identification with the role. It's just an idea in the mind.
Between Suicides
Re: What is consciousness?
A Christian would likely conclude:
Romans 12:2
And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the
renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and
acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
Romans 12:2
And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the
renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and
acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
-
- Posts: 3851
- Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 4:12 pm
- Location: Flippen-well AUSTRALIA
Re: What is consciousness?
How you say … ah, ah, … ossification.