GENIUS FORUMS

Leyla wrote:

I used to offer up the same argument. I wondered about its efficacy toward the stated goals of the forum. Thing is, when you observe those particular qualities -- masculinity (which would be the capacity for truth, wisdom and the ability to reason) -- predominantly in conjunction with males, then you can logically call them “masculine,” notwithstanding the fact that most males, on the same basis, can be observed to exhibit their opposite qualities, ie “femininity.”

The absolute male and the absolute female are hypothetical. It is from this hypothesis alone that one can define and analyse such characteristics. Seeking for the existence of an absolute male/female would be like trying to find a 2-dimensional object to experience. But, in the same vein as every other object can be experienced, the qualities can be observed in the nature and manifestation (appearances) of objects that are experienced/perceived (if you are masculine enough, that is).

The idea that wisdom and enlightenment can be attained by or through the personal experience of objects as an object is, therefore, utterly deluded.

The mind contains both masculine and feminine characteristics, as you have stated. This being the case, the enlightened mind utilizes both to perceive wisdom. When there is an imbalance, due to ego, unconsciousness results and is labeled feminine. You are correct, reason is needed to discern the reality of an object.

No, you deal with feelings. My argument discerns reason from feeling. You, on the other hand, simply want to merge all of human existence into one big feeling.

I can listen to reason.

I can't listen to pointless contest.

Naturally, if you feel that way, you will feel “enlightened.”

Leyla, understand this:

If you don't know what enlightenment is, then you cannot possibly assess it.

Your insistance that I prove my enlightenment to you, shows me that have no idea what it is.

And even an enlightened being, still has imperfections.

Unlike your openly proclaimed desire to seek and feel personal pleasure from my existence, I am only interested in truth, thought, reason.

It's not healthy to bottle up your feelings, Leyla.

Mentally and physically.

It is clear even in your own philosophy that everything necessarily comes down to feelings with you. Hence, I find you are and thereby will be eternally immature, philosophically -- not feeling-wise, that is; you apparently have much maturity there. On the other hand, if I were one big, throbbing cunt -- I think I’d find you extremely mature.

Wisdom can arise from feeling.

In fact, all thought arises from feeling.

Give up this thoughtless, materialist doctrine. You may then attain your goal of becoming a better philosopher.

I have my philosophy.

I don't have myself, yet.

Whydo I say all this?

Because you haven't found yourself either.

Self-contradiction momentarily notwithstanding, how exactly is that a fact, Steven?

Are facts the truth?

The dispossessed one wrote:

The mind contains both masculine and feminine characteristics, as you have stated. This being the case, the enlightened mind utilizes both to perceive wisdom. When there is an imbalance, due to ego, unconsciousness results and is labeled feminine. You are correct, reason is needed to discern the reality of an object.

Is there any wisdom in the reality of 3D objects (appearances via the senses)?

I can listen to reason.

No you can’t. You only hear contest.

Your insistance that I prove my enlightenment to you, shows me that have no idea what it is.

I am not asking you to prove anything, I have already decided you are not enlightened. It does not concern me that you don't like that. I am asking you to explain, with logic, your philosophy.

And even an enlightened being, still has imperfections.

That further takes away any meaning to the idea of enlightenment. On its own -- and you have provided nothing else of substance to substantiate it -- it’s nothing more than part of a post-modernist feel-good “philosophy.” You repeat these things as if they were affirmations to yourself.

It's not healthy to bottle up your feelings, Leyla.

Mentally and physically.

[laughs] You’re kidding, right? I have been very clear about my feelings toward your ignorance -- and the reasoning behind it.

Wisdom can arise from feeling.

In fact, all thought arises from feeling.

That's a bold and still unsubstantiated statement to make. I say, no. Wisdom arises from thought as a consequence of the ability to discern truth (reality) from lies (delusion). That’s why you cannot “find yourself.” Why do you keep searching? In what are you looking?

I have my philosophy.

I don't have myself, yet.

Sorry? Have yourself? What kind of an object are you?

Because you haven't found yourself either.

Well, when you find yourself and there’s actually someone there to be spoken to, let me know and you might find you were always the lost one, as you continue to so clearly state.

L: Self-contradiction momentarily notwithstanding, how exactly is that a fact, Steven?

S: Are facts the truth?

Nice try. But, you’re on your own on this one. Just prior to my self-quote above, the discussion of your philosophy centred (and continues to centre) around feelings as the source/cause of thought and wisdom. I questioned you as follows:

L: You insist enlightenment can be attained by and through objects as an object (by your objection to my statement that it cannot) yet, here you state enlightenment is near when the mind realises that nothing exists other than itself.

And you stated:

I deal with facts.

Do you now mean to say that facts are not truth and, therefore, you deal in lies?

I mean, being more interested in reason than contest, what else could you have been referring to but the substance of the discussion at hand?

Course, just to confuse the issue, you superficially agreed that reason is needed to discern the reality of an object. I return us to that same issue, despite your witting or unwitting attempt to confuse the situation, at the beginning of this post.

Prove that you are more interested in reason than contest, Steven. Respond to the argument and stop trying to run us around in circles. Head-spin is not conducive to thought. I do not suffer from it.

Is there any wisdom in the reality of 3D objects (appearances via the senses)?

What do you mean, exactly?

No you can’t. You only hear contest.

Do we all have blindspots?

I am not asking you to prove anything, I have already decided you are not enlightened. It does not concern me that you don't like that. I am asking you to explain, with logic, your philosophy.

I am a Zennist by nature, and a Taoist at heart.

Logic is rarely used in either.

Mainly, intuitive realization.

!

That further takes away any meaning to the idea of enlightenment. On its own -- and you have provided nothing else of substance to substantiate it -- it’s nothing more than part of a post-modernist feel-good “philosophy.” You repeat these things as if they were affirmations to yourself.

:)

Isn't everything we write?

[laughs] You’re kidding, right? I have been very clear about my feelings toward your ignorance -- and the reasoning behind it.

I offered that in response to your criticism of "feeling" as a negative trait.

That's a bold and still unsubstantiated statement to make. I say, no. Wisdom arises from thought as a consequence of the ability to discern truth (reality) from lies (delusion). That’s why you cannot “find yourself.” Why do you keep searching? In what are you looking?

Why do I keep searching?

Everything.

Sorry? Have yourself? What kind of an object are you?

I am an introvert.

I am learning to extrovert.

Well, when you find yourself and there’s actually someone there to be spoken to, let me know and you might find you were always the lost one, as you continue to so clearly state.

Okay.

Do you now mean to say that facts are not truth and, therefore, you deal in lies?

Facts are not indictive of truth.

That's where reason comes in.

Prove that you are more interested in reason than contest, Steven. Respond to the argument and stop trying to run us around in circles. Head-spin is not conducive to thought. I do not suffer from it.

The world is like a piece of music.

And that music is your own mind.

The forms, structure, space, time, tonality, timbre - are all abstractly expressing the nature of Reality.

That is the best I can do to illustrate enlightenment via three-dimensional objects.

--

Do you remember when you experienced Zazen in the park?

Frank,

Getting oneself enlightened is one Game.

Assisting Others is a brand new Game...one demanding great skill...my feeling is that Dave is passionate about learning and acquiring this skill...it takes time to learn...if we make him 'work' we all benefit...he's in the deep end.

Makes sense.

.

Steven,

What do you mean, exactly?

Well, I’m asking you what you mean when you say that wisdom and enlightenment can be attained by and through an object as an object. If it’s still not clear, I’ll have to try and come up with some other way to get clarification/definition from you.

Do we all have blindspots?

How would you know? Even if someone else were to point one out to you, it being a blindspot, how would you know? Would I have to hit you over the head with a solid object?

Logic is rarely used in either.

I think you might want to reconsider that! But, I must say, only from my understanding that every decision anyone makes requires some type of logic. So, unless there’s absolutely nothing decisive about anything in it as a composite body of knowledge or whole philosophy, then it contains logic.

Mainly, intuitive realization.

So, we should all just go with our intuition? Think of the person in your life you consider least enlightened and explain to me how that person is not acting on intuition.

How do you distinguish the concept of unconsciousness from intuition? By the accompanying feelings/sensations?

Isn't everything we write [affirmations to yourself]?

Not for me. When I‘m thinking, the last thing on my mind is the need to feel positive about what I am saying. I don‘t think being truthful has such requirements. Insecurity does, however.

I offered that in response to your criticism of "feeling" as a negative trait.

I have said much more about “feeling” than you have cared enough to address.

Why do I keep searching [for himself]?

Everything.

Then, you will be looking forever and be, therefore, forever lost. Nice gig, if that’s what turns you on. But it ain’t my idea of enlightenment (comprehension of the nature of reality) and wisdom. I mean, I think any ol’ arsehole can lose himself. You just fluff it up with airs and graces, that’s all.

I am an introvert.

I am learning to extrovert.

How do you know if you haven’t found yourself!?

Facts are not indictive of truth.

That's where reason comes in.

So, you are retracting your statement of fact (which you claim to always deal in and which now becomes “an idea not indicative of truth”) that enlightenment can be attained through objects as an object because you have not reasoned it out? Is that how you escape the ability for and necessity of reason and logic? Or, are you saying it’s up to everyone else to reason out your facts and, thus, find truth?

Wow. [laughs] Really, that’s impressive. I have to say, some mighty fucking unbelievable logic! Oh, wait -- intuition, right?

The world is like a piece of music.

And that music is your own mind.

The forms, structure, space, time, tonality, timbre - are all abstractly expressing the nature of Reality.

That is the best I can do to illustrate enlightenment via three-dimensional objects.

The understanding that objects, including your mind, do not exist apart from your own mind?

That’s a fairly fundamental concept on this forum, though. It’s called Emptiness, isn’t it? My point is, Steven, it is not the experiencing of objects that produces enlightenment. I think that if that were the case, many more of us would have all indulged ourselves to enlightenment a hundred times over by now.

Enlightenment (freedom from delusion) cannot possibly manifest as anything other than clarity of thought. Would you expect a non-deluded individual to have any difficulty with it?

Experiencing objects as a means to enlightenment implies no abstract (reason, logic, truth, wisdom) quality, unless you swap the definition of objects with that of abstraction -- which is all you have done here.

Steven asked:

Do you remember when you experienced Zazen in the park?

That, and many other experiences. I remember our conversation, too.

I remember my first kiss and how my heart was beating, my utter grief at leaving England and my friends, the smell of Lorraine’s house, the tone of her red hair, her freckles. I remember my disgust at Deborah and Annette eating snails and my wanting to have bunk beds like them: my sadness when Seamus threw a brick and cut Michael‘s eye, my awe at the contrast of a perfectly round spot of his red blood against his dark, dark skin. I remember my brother beating Seamus up when he caught him encouraging me to smoke. I remember the smell of our attic and the pram I used to play in: the window sills, the view into the back yard; stepping on my baby chick and killing it. I remember the cold of the snow and the delicious taste of my teacher’s home made greens, dumplings, roast beef and gravy at my farewell dinner. I remember getting the absolute shit kicked out of me so much so that I couldn’t feel any pain, that I saw my body being hurled around on the ground, looking down on it from the upper corner of the room. I remember falling in love and being devastated by it. I remember losing my friend in a car accident when we were 16, and I remember how he cared for me. I remember E’ing out of my head at a party in the bush in the middle of nowhere, great sex, vivid hallucinations of musicians playing their instruments courtesy of Bob Marley -- mm hm, I remember Bob Marley -- and other substances, the clarity, sheer life and distinction of sound, as if each instrument had jumped out of the stereo and into the room; the smile on my face. The fear of imminent death and the feeling that my neck was bent on a 180 degree angle to the rest of my motionless body into the pillow -- I remember crying and cleaning up my own vomit to save others the trouble despite the fact that I was going to die.

And I remember the breath of an inebriated young boy with a three-inch slash under his right eye -- about 17 years old, I reckon -- today who asked me if he could take a seat at my table. I indicated for him to take a seat. I think I will always remember the shock on his face and his laugh in reaction to this totally unexpected event when I said I would not buy him any food and took to discussing the nature of his actions with him for an odd half-hour, or so. Almost like he sobered up instantly, for a moment or two. I remember him being speechless at various moments and thanking me when he left, despite his still empty stomach. I remember the lady at the table behind him saying she would never have spoken to him (despite her experiencing similar objects to me at the time).

Out of all of that (and much more that I have spared you) I don’t remember being enlightened by or through the experiencing of any of the objects involved. If I did, I think there would have been no need to experience anything other than the very first object.

[Edit: general grammar and spelling]

How would you know? Even if someone else were to point one out to you, it being a blindspot, how would you know? Would I have to hit you over the head with a solid object?

I don't know.

So, we should all just go with our intuition? Think of the person in your life you consider least enlightened and explain to me how that person is not acting on intuition.

How do you distinguish the concept of unconsciousness from intuition? By the accompanying feelings/sensations?

With consciousness of Truth, intuition is heightened.

Not for me. When I‘m thinking, the last thing on my mind is the need to feel positive about what I am saying. I don‘t think being truthful has such requirements. Insecurity does, however.

You're right.

Then, you will be looking forever and be, therefore, forever lost. Nice gig, if that’s what turns you on. But it ain’t my idea of enlightenment (comprehension of the nature of reality) and wisdom. I mean, I think any ol’ arsehole can lose himself. You just fluff it up with airs and graces, that’s all.

You don't know the complications I have to deal with.

I'm sorting things out the best I can.

My point is, Steven, it is not the experiencing of objects that produces enlightenment. I think that if that were the case, many more of us would have all indulged ourselves to enlightenment a hundred times over by now.

It depends on what you mean by enlightenment, Leyla.

Spiritual growth never stops.

Sapius:

Quote:
Getting oneself enlightened is one Game.

Assisting Others is a brand new Game...one demanding great skill...my feeling is that Dave is passionate about learning and acquiring this skill...it takes time to learn...if we make him 'work' we all benefit...he's in the deep end.


Makes sense.

Dave himself says that the Sage who sits in the Palace (Theravada)..is something that doesn't appeal to him.

That the Sage who goes out into the World and teaches his Wisdom (Mahayana) does appeal.

Dave says he 'grapples' with the Monkey Mind of Others and the myriad permutations of the Monkey Mind's restlessness in it's avoidance of Truth.

He has to 'know' the Game of the Monkey Mind to catch it at it's every twist...to Say the exact right thing at the exact right moment to catch the Monkey Mind in its Fallacy...you just know when you've trapped a Monkey Mind...you can see the 'dawning of Insight' on the Person's Face as realisation strikes..

It's like the best Cop/Detective can 'think' like the Criminal...knows every nuance of it.

The successful Boddhisatva has to know how to play all the '88 keys in the Scale' as unwise points out...

You can only do this if 'free of judgement'...and that means resolving the opposites in yourself...
If you are projecting 'bad' onto Another...you have to realise that 'bad' is in yourself, even if as only potential ( there I go but for the Grace of prior Causes)...in that way Compassion arrives and you can 'engage' with the Other authentically...and Transmission happens...Self and Other integrate....
Judgement drives Self/Other apart...doesn't work.

There's 2 Marvellous Films about Men who got Integrated...
Zorba the Greek....(fictional account of the type)

Schindler's List...based on a true story of a Man who could 'play the spectrum'...very moving.

We are all becoming.

It's all in the Wonderful Game.

Every Breath that's taken is the most wonderful opportunity.

Sigh

frank

Frank,

It's like the best Cop/Detective can 'think' like the Criminal...knows every nuance of it.

The successful Boddhisatva has to know how to play all the '88 keys in the Scale' as unwise points out...

With all due respect, pointing out is all well and good, but eventually one can do only the best he possibly can. I don’t think playing all the ’88 keys in the scale’ is actually possible, if you know what I mean, because it involves certain individual subjective thoughts based on their own rhythm of logic, hence not all criminals can be caught irrelevant of a Sherlock Homes being assigned to every county. Have you ever come across any one, past or present, who can actually play all the keys?

It essentially depends more on the seeker rather than the giver; a real curious mind will somehow find the spark hidden behind all that smoke and fire.

Every Breath that's taken is the most wonderful opportunity.

Of course it is! But you can't make others realize that, it has to come from within.

In comparison to Schindler's List, I am reminded of the last spoken word of that Japanese Samurai dyeing in the arms of Tom Cruse while watching the cherry blossoms….. Perfect. Can there be any more integration?

Perfection in that its empty and meaningless…… that…. Its empty and meaningless… and yet... WOW!

Leyla,

zagreus: In your opinion, who is the least ignorant person on this forum?

Leyla: zag, Given the objectives of this forum, the least ignorant people on it are the forum moderators themselves who have provided and continue to provide enough evidence of clarity of thought to have put it here. There are a few others whose clarity I appreciate, whether or not I agree or disagree with the content.

zagreus: Which others?

Well?

And why do you lump the moderators together?

Sapius:

Perfection in that its empty and meaningless…… that…. Its empty and meaningless… and yet... WOW!

That what's empty and meaningless? Death?

suergaz wrote:Sapius:

Perfection in that its empty and meaningless…… that…. Its empty and meaningless… and yet... WOW!

That what's empty and meaningless? Death?

No… no… no, not Death, for pete's sake, that has inherent meaning. :D

.

Death means life, but why is life without meaning...for petes sake? :D

suergaz wrote:Death means life, but why is life without meaning...for petes sake? :D

C'mmon now Zag. Can I teach you anything about inherency?

How can death mean life and life not mean death? :D

I'm a great student of life, you can teach me the inherency of yours---its meaning. Life and death mean eachother, but also themselves, inherently. Where we perceive life to lack meaning is where we cannot help but make meaning. Death as means to life. :D To more.

Zag,

I'm a great student of life, you can teach me the inherency of yours---its meaning.

Perfect.

.

Maybe, but look at what I wrote in lifes rush! "To more"?! :D I mean our own!

suergaz wrote:Maybe, but look at what I wrote in lifes rush! "To more"?! :D I mean our own!

I'm sorry. Could you give me another hint? Lifes rush? To more? :D? "I mean our own"? Nope... still lost.

Death as means to our own life, not more life, or another life.

Life has meaning where we bestow it with meaning.

Suergaz,

This is not a chat-room for one-sentence replies and quips. You need to put more substance into your posts.

Write us an essay.

Last warning.

Sapius wrote:
With all due respect, pointing out is all well and good, but eventually one can do only the best he possibly can. I don’t think playing all the ’88 keys in the scale’ is actually possible, if you know what I mean, because it involves certain individual subjective thoughts based on their own rhythm of logic, hence not all criminals can be caught irrelevant of a Sherlock Homes being assigned to every county. Have you ever come across any one, past or present, who can actually play all the keys?

I've been there in rooms a few times where a skilled Zen person or a skilled Tibetan Buddhist person has engaged the monkey mind of another...has 'followed' the meandering monkey mind's cleverness down it's trails that lead nowhere in particular...and the skilled person has been able to Say the exact right thing at the exact right moment to 'catch the monkey'...it's an Awesome skill...these guys know where the 'monkey will seek to escape to next...and they are there waiting...
Sometimes the monkey mind gets very angry and runs away hurling insults over it's shoulder when the Meanings it cherishes are shown to be fallacious...

The skilled person has no judgement of the monkey mind or the person with the monkey mind...for the skilled person has come to know his own monkey mind and accepted it...the skilled person doesn't get into a Me/You split...I'm holier than thou thang...that would be more monkey mind...

Following the trail of the monkey mind eventually 'reveals' Monkey Mind...how else can it be done except in a Conversation with a skilled person who 'stays the course' with you?

These skilled people are in a sense Master Psychologists....'playing the 88 keys' means being able to interact as authentically as possible with whoever/whatever 'pops out of' the Void as an 'arising' at any given moment...I am You and You are Me...

Arriving at any 'new moment' with Judgements, Rules, prejudices, pre-conceptions whatever...is the phenomenon that 'blinds' to Reality...

To experience Reality..one has to keep arriving 'empty'...

Because it's empty and meaningless except for the meaning you
'provide'....

From what you are writing Sapius..I think the 'penny may have dropped' for you...about empty and meaningless...it is truly Awesome.

It essentially depends more on the seeker rather than the giver; a real curious mind will somehow find the spark hidden behind all that smoke and fire.

Yeah...many 'givers' only want to 'give' to those who make the effort to approach and humbly ask...

In comparison to Schindler's List, I am reminded of the last spoken word of that Japanese Samurai dyeing in the arms of Tom Cruse while watching the cherry blossoms….. Perfect. Can there be any more integration?

Perfect..A Beautiful Form of dying...but then again it's all beautiful...

Perfection in that its empty and meaningless…… that…. Its empty and meaningless… and yet... WOW!

Yeah! WOW!

frank

Frank,

I've been there in rooms a few times where a skilled Zen person or a skilled Tibetan Buddhist person has engaged the monkey mind of another...has 'followed' the meandering monkey mind's cleverness down it's trails that lead nowhere in particular...and the skilled person has been able to Say the exact right thing at the exact right moment to 'catch the monkey'...it's an Awesome skill...these guys know where the 'monkey will seek to escape to next...and they are there waiting...

I understand exactly what you mean and I agree, and I find that to be the most natural way to actually communicate with anyone at any level of mental development with ease; be it a five year old child at play, or a 60 year old person with well rooted preconceived beliefs and ideas. In my opinion I find the best way eventually is to leave a person with a thought-provoking question on his ideas, to work it out for himself, who may or may not later realize that the question itself held the answer, since ultimately, it does not really matter.

However, knowing to play 88 keys to me actually meant being able to master communication with each and everyone and make them understand, but as you say here…

Sometimes the monkey mind gets very angry and runs away hurling insults over it's shoulder when the Meanings it cherishes are shown to be fallacious...

This is what I meant earlier when I mentioned about the involvement of ‘others rhythm of logic’, hence even a person said to know to play “all the 88 keys” can only do so much. So in that sense, he is at least short of one key, due to those very angry monkey minds running away. Can we then settle for 87 keys? :D

I agree with all other things you say on the matter.

Sapius: In comparison to Schindler's List, I am reminded of the last spoken word of that Japanese Samurai dyeing in the arms of Tom Cruse while watching the cherry blossoms….. Perfect. Can there be any more integration?

Frank: Perfect..A Beautiful Form of dying...but then again it's all beautiful...

Yes, all is beautiful, but I was not looking at the beauty aspect in the form of dying, rather his utterly deep understanding of the meaninglessness, and his place in it. At least that is how I see it.

Well aware of the few moments of awareness he had on hand, that a simple blooming flower, in which he finds perfection although he lays dying, is the present meaning he finds. The word 'perfect' actually encompasses existence. It was not actually only the flower, but he finds perfection in his own death too, his conscious life, and every thing else.

He did teach a bit to ‘Tom cruse’ too, since at the end of the movie he tells the King when asked, “You were with him till the end?”, “yes” he replies, “Tell me how he died?” asks the King, to which Tom cruse replies, “ no, I will tell you how he lived”. Showing that all meaning giving and meaning lies in the alive, so why ask about death?

The Samurai was absolutely aware of the script he was performing and the meaning making. Death really meant nothing to him, absolute loyalty to the king really meant nothing to him, his wife, his children, fellow warriors, all and anything really meant nothing, except what he meant it to be and when. Accepting the meaning in the script, which he played to the last, seeing perfection of creation in everything, through a simple flower, well aware that it actually meant nothing. He is actually expressing his awe at his own experiential existence, which also actually means nothing. And that is awesome.

How much more integrated can one consciously be with all that there is, then this? That is what I meant earlier.

One cannot really express his awe at anything without first consciously acknowledging the awe in a meaningless experiential self, for what thing could possibly be without an awesome self, especially when it holds no Real meaning, taking it infinitely way beyond awesome, and anything that that may mean.

,

Sapius wrote:
The Samurai was absolutely aware of the script he was performing and the meaning making. Death really meant nothing to him, absolute loyalty to the king really meant nothing to him, his wife, his children, fellow warriors, all and anything really meant nothing, except what he meant it to be and when. Accepting the meaning in the script, which he played to the last, seeing perfection of creation in everything, through a simple flower, well aware that it actually meant nothing. He is actually expressing his awe at his own experiential existence, which also actually means nothing. And that is awesome.

How much more integrated can one consciously be with all that there is, then this? That is what I meant earlier.

One cannot really express his awe at anything without first consciously acknowledging the awe in a meaningless experiential self, for what thing could possibly be without an awesome self, especially when it holds no Real meaning, taking it infinitely way beyond awesome, and anything that that may mean.

,

Exquisite perception in these expressions you give rise to Sapius...such a light, delicate touch...

Life isn't really Work..something to be overcome, controlled, resisted...
...but rather a Playing and an appreciation 'things never remain the same' and an ability to accept and adjust to everchanging circumstances...

Nevertheless, when 'empty and meaningless' is understood one desires to persist...
...and one then requires a Script to Live into as an Artform for oneself, as an expression, as an 'emptiness' one can 'fill' with one's Energy...and one can feel upon one's dying that one has Lived and 'become'...'fulfilled'...and at the moment of one's dying one can gaze at the blossom and realise it goes on and be in Awe and at Peace with this astonishing occurrence of Life...

I like that Samurai's Script and his Wisdom.

I like that Oscar Schindler and the Script he wrote for himself and his ability to 'pull it off'...a completely extraordinary Player, I'm totally amazed and happy that the Totality could produce such a creature...

frank

Up. For Passthrough.