GENIUS FORUMS

In becoming enlightened, it seems to me, it is important to dissociate rational thoughts from those thought that are automatic responses. Thoughts and ideas that simply 'pop up', rather than being the logical consequence of a preceding thought, have no place in an enlightened mind.

Eliminating irrational thought seems very difficult and has long seemed impossible to me because so much thought seems to be coming out of nowhere. These thoughts, which I classify as animal, are so pervasive that I personally did not think it to be possible to think entirely rationally. There did not seem to be enough space amid all the irrational thoughts that came into my mind. You might say I did not see how it was possible to let go of my ego, something many people seem to struggle with.

What has caused me to regain faith in the idea that thought can be rational to a great extent is the realisation that our thoughts are not necessary for survival. We can respond to the environment in such a way that we will not die of hunger, thirst, or cold, and not a single conscious thought is necessary for it. The animal world shows that it must be possible, but that it is possible with humans too does not cross the mind of most people. Our consciousness is not what acts. For example, when we are hungry, we get something to eat, but at no point do we need to think of getting something to eat. Of course a conscious thought ("I have no time to eat, I must get to work!") can intervene to change our behavior, but to reach our goals no conscious thought is necessary.

Nothing has encouraged me more to seek to eliminate irrational thought than the idea that we do not need to think to survive. It leaves me free to a) stop identifying with my irrational thoughts and b) think rationally as much as I please without fearing that 'things will go wrong'. It allows me to observe my behavior, my thoughts, and my feelings from a distance. It means that when I burn myself I may retract my finger and experience pain, but there is no need for this to directly affect my rational worldview at all.

Perhaps these ideas seem badly structured at the moment. In truth, they are rather new and unpolished (although grounded on rational deliberation and even on scientific facts), but they did seem worth mentioning here on this forum: perhaps they will be of use to somebody. Comments are very welcome.

Have a nice day!

Kind regards,

a Student

What would you say would be the main idea of eliminating irrational thought, repression perhaps?

I am not sure you can eliminate irrational thoughts by repressing them. Rather, I think it involves placing less value on the thoughts, seeing them as unnecessary, as a byproduct of physical processes rather than the cause of these processes. This way there is no more need to keep them.

Take meditation. If you clear your head of all thoughts, what is it that makes them return despite your intentions to keep them out? For me it is a sense of discomfort or even fear that 'something bad will happen' when I do not reflect or plan or remember.. thinking might be no more than a compulsion.

Having said that, this kind of thinking is crucial if you want to 'get along' in today's society which is full of communication and technology and requires a lot of spoken words. No wonder so many thoughts pop up - we are formulating sentences all the time.

Student85,

If you clear your head of all thoughts, what is it that makes them return despite your intentions to keep them out?

Unresolved, yes. However, sometimes facing repressed demons from the past maybe potentially more detrimental to one's mental health, then if we were to try and forget about them. I've heard of cases, mostly in children, where they'll have some sort of trauma happen to them, only to go into shock and forget about it. They'll wake up the next day, with no recollection of the previous day. This is why it's sometimes better not to mess with one's subconscious -- doing drugs and being hypnotized by a non-professional can be very dangerous.

For me it is a sense of discomfort or even fear that 'something bad will happen' when I do not reflect or plan or remember.. thinking might be no more than a compulsion.

I've experienced the same thing. It's similar to OCD or an anxiety attack. I don't consider it normal, so if most people (~the norm) have similar chronic episodes, then "most people" are actually insane to varying degrees. Society seems to encourage and even demand these types of behavior - a typical workaholic is one and their rewarded and further encouraged with job promotions and increased pay, etc.