GENIUS FORUMS

Leyla,

Is this an answer that’s supposed to prove what I posted on the subject of oil is not factual and represents jumping to conclusions?

Help me out if I get this wrong...you said that because the US imports a lot of crude oil, it means they're stealing it from the middle east? Or at least trying to get it cheaper? You posted links to websites which had the numbers, claiming that the government is revealing that it's doing this.

But I don't think that just because like half of the US's crude oil is imported, it means that the war in Iraq is about oil. We've always gotten oil from other places in the world. If the numbers have risen, perhaps it was just because we don't want to use up our own reserves!

Not because the war was about getting more oil for less money.

Dan,

I'm glad you posted what your former IDF friend talked to you about. It is very truthful.

it is as religious and ideologically mad (Zionistically) as any of its so-called enemies.

I have no doubt that it is mad in many ways.

But the Islamic fundamentalists want Islamic law to rule the entire planet, and are ready to implement it given any opportunity. Are the Jewish fundamentalists of the same mindset? I doubt it. I think the fundamentalist Jews will be much more tolerant of other religions, like Buddhism, or of atheism, partly because of the intolerance that has been shown to Jews in the past.

She said the sorts of societal elements that Kevin has been arguing are meaningfully present in Israel are just not there at all.

Most of the atheists and agnostics in Israel are in the younger generations and therefore are not in positions of power.

She said her Zionist minded family, whom she had to leave behind and from whom she has been cut off, are typical "kill or die for the cause" people.

That "cause" is the state of Israel, is it not? They're not going on a crusade to kill all non-Jews.

There are a lot of Australians who will "kill or die for the cause" of Australia, if Australia was seriously under threat by fundamentalist Muslims. Are those Australians equally ideologically mad?

I will grant you that the Jewish religion is just about as irrational a religion as you could possibly get. I used to listen to a radio program where they spoke to visiting religious leaders and teachers. On one occasion they spoke to a visiting elder Rabbi, who was supposedly the most highly learned and respected Rabbi anywhere. His words were the most appalling pap I have ever heard from any religious teacher - including Christian priests - and that's saying a lot. His words weren't violent, fighting words, they were just . . . empty, nonsense, juvenile babbling. I couldn't believe anyone could speak so many words without uttering a single one that even approached making any sense.

Your "facts" are nonsense Kevin. Shit. Palestinians feel oppressed? How can you type that with a straight keyboard? What the hell does it take for you to say that a population actually is oppressed? Can you just spit it out, just the once, even if you think it justified? Do it for me, just the one time...

Anyway, with regard to the possibility of peace and stability in that region (if the will is actually there, especially from the US) it's worth remembering that Carter helped Panama become free and independent from the yolk of US control. He also helped broker the eventual relations between Egypt and Israel (arguably Jordan as well) - the two nations most threatening to Israel militarily. But Carter's way was apparently the "wimp's" way.

All hail modernity.

ksolway wrote:But the Islamic fundamentalists want Islamic law to rule the entire planet, and are ready to implement it given any opportunity. Are the Jewish fundamentalists of the same mindset? I doubt it.

Given the opportunity, yes, absolutely, yes. What do you think the Zionist movement in the US is all about? Jesus wept, have I not already posted enough material to demonstrate this? Do I have to start linking back to material I've posted in this thread?

You can look back in history at Christian and Jewish people slaughtering nonbelievers. You can say that in the future perhaps these religions will become more like the fanatical Muslims of today, and that some perhaps are just like them. However, not on such a widespread scale.

People aren't catching Christians plotting to commit terrorist acts. A good example is the UK Muslims that were caught for liquid explosives. There are no Jews or Christians doing such things.

Do you know how many Xians, all told, have committed "terrorist" acts on US soil over the years? Or is that one of those facts of your own nation that you don't know about like "Signing Statements"?

But I guess you'll just argue that domestic terror isn't the same as ...blah blah..

You scare me sometimes, Scott. Mostly because you are typical of Americans who don't know who the real enemy is...or want to consider there are more immediate ones than Muslims.

As a single, non-domestic example, try Googling "5 dancing Israelis" and get back to me..

drowden wrote:What the hell does it take for you to say that a population actually is oppressed?

It is true that Palestinians are oppressed, but I don't believe that the Israelis are purposely trying to oppress and destroy their lives.

Note that I also said that the Israelis "feel" threatened, so I wasn't being biased to one side or the other. The Israelis really are threatened, and really are blown-up.

On a much smaller scale, the people at Heathrow airport are being "oppressed" by having their flights cancelled and having to queue up for hours to get through security, and pay extra for the privilege.

I think it is an overly emotional word to use, in both cases, since it implies the blaming of an oppressor.

I agree that the oppression is unacceptable, in all cases, but I already know about the oppression, I'm more interested in solutions.

drowden wrote:

ksolway wrote:But the Islamic fundamentalists want Islamic law to rule the entire planet, and are ready to implement it given any opportunity. Are the Jewish fundamentalists of the same mindset? I doubt it.

Given the opportunity, yes, absolutely, yes. What do you think the Zionist movement in the US is all about?

Well I haven't heard anything about Jews wanting to wipe out and replace all non-Jewish religions, so I think it must be an American thing.

As far as I know, there is still a good amount of free speech in Israel, so the fundamentalism can't be too bad.

sschaula wrote:People aren't catching Christians plotting to commit terrorist acts.

I would argue that the extremist Christians who were doing things like killing doctors that performed abortions were committing terrorist acts.

And let's not forget that American home-grown institution, the Ku Klux Klan.

Dan,

Do you know how many Xians, all told, have committed "terrorist" acts on US soil over the years?

No. So I looked it up on wikipedia (the greatest thing ever invented)...

Examples of attacks and aggression

October 2, 2004- Christian terrorist group kills 44 Hindus, wounds 118 in Northeast India.

2003- Preacher Michael Evans calls for a holy war and "cleansing" against non-Christians.

January 16, 1997- Catholic terrorist Eric Robert Rudolph bombs nightclub.

July 27, 1996- Christian Identity terrorist Eric Robert Rudolph bombs Centennial Olympic Park. Kills 1, wounds 111.

April 19, 1995- Oklahoma City bombing

1983- Posse Comitatus militia member Gordon Kahl kills two
Federal marshals in North Dakota. Three others were wounded.

1978- Christian cult "the Peoples' Temple" leader Jim Jones allegedly kills 913 people with cyanide-laced Kool Aid. People trying to escape the compound are shot.

1976- Nearly 300 people are killed in Ireland as a result of bombings between Catholics and Protestants.

1940s- Terrorist organization Christian Identity is formed on the West Coast of the United States. Followers believe Armageddon will take place as a race war between Aryans, the "pure" people, against Jews, Muslims, and non-whites.

Christian terrorism in the United States

In the United States, arson, firebombing and vandalism of abortion clinics, along with harassment of clinic employees and patrons have been cited as examples of terror tactics employed by anti-abortion extremists. Occasionally the perpetrators have been self-proclaimed Christians.

Eric Rudolph, for example, engaged in terrorist activities closely associated with Christian terrorism, such as the targeting of abortion clinics and the bombing of a gay nightclub; also, Rudolph had been suspected to be associated with the Christian Identity organization. While Rudolph has himself denied such associations, writing that he "prefers Nietzsche to the Bible", he has clearly said "I was born a Catholic, and with forgiveness I hope to die one."

Many abortion opponents attempt to blame these acts of violence on individuals who have little regard for human life and groups which they view are separate from the pro-life movement or any Christian church.

Does that really compare to what we're seeing with Islam? Sure, it's stupid shit...but it isn't nearly as dangerous or as widespread.

Or is that one of those facts of your own nation that you don't know about like "Signing Statements"?

I just looked up signing statements. So Bush doesn't veto laws, but adds his input about them...why should that make me wary? It sounds like a president that cares about things, but wants to be fair.

But I guess you'll just argue that domestic terror isn't the same as ...blah blah..

No...terror is terror.

You scare me sometimes, Scott. Mostly because you are typical of Americans who don't know who the real enemy is...or want to consider there are more immediate ones than Muslims.

Sure, there are more immediate ones than fanatical Muslims. There are bad people that live in America...probably right down the street from me. They could break in and kill me. If I walk down the streets of a major city, there are enemies closer than fanatical Muslims. Some people have wanted to cause me harm just because they don't like who I am...the vibes they got from me or something. The only thing that's stopped them, in my opinion, is that they can sense on some level that they'd quickly get payback, ten thousand fold, for anything done to myself, my friends or my family.

But that doesn't take away from the fact that fanatical Muslims ARE a major enemy. More of a threat than anyone I know.

Show me a more dangerous and relevant threat. My government? Yeah right. I can live free in my country and they don't bother me.

As a single, non-domestic example, try Googling "5 dancing Israelis" and get back to me..

So Mossad agents probably knew about the attack before hand, and took photos and videos of it.

What I don't like about reading these things is that they all try to begin to claim that 9-11 was planned by Zionist elements of the US government. I think that kind of propoganda is retarded.

But, what does it mean when teams of intelligence agents are in another country during a catastrophe? It could mean they were planted there for a while, to look at something other than the catastrophe. It could mean that covert parts of the agency were led to believe the catastrophe could take place, and sent them. It could in fact mean that covert parts of the agency planned and executed the attacks...but I doubt it.

I think that most likely, small parts of Mossad were following the terrorists and spying on them. It's strange that they were so lighthearted about the attacks, but does that necessarily mean they were planning the attacks themselves? I don't think so.

Perhaps you never heard Dan and Naturyl's rant about the 9/11 conspiracies, Scott. Maybe Dan could be so kind as to summarize for us.

But there is truth in what he says about the progressives and thinking people of Isreal leaving the area. At my last position, I made friends with a woman who joined the faculty of our department who came from Isreal for that very reason. And it is instances such as these that, as Kevin said, the state may fail. That would be cause for dancing in the streets, would it not, Dan and Leyla and Marsha?

But before that happens, the right wing religious lunatics will probably nuke the whole place as a result of conflict with the Muslim right wing religious lunatics. And sure enough, more "innocent people" will die.

We may get angry with the others based on the sides we have chosen. But in reality it offers only one outcome. There is no understanding. At least Dan has offered an honest atempt at some explaination. Marsha and Leyla, as their usual selves, simply get emotional and call names, I suppose because it must work against lesser people in their daily lives. In fact, the entire world can be found reflected in the microcosm of this thread.

I've just been reading articles about the Palestine/Israeli conflict, gleaned from websites like albalagh.net, famsy.com, axisoflogic.com, and stuff about the fiqh academy and such like. All sides of the affair boil down to "God knows the answer, human knowledge is limited, and I believe in my group's values". Even atheists have the same attitude. At least the essays' authors' names are published, even if no one steps out of the shadows of the mob.

Scott Schauland wrote:I just looked up signing statements. So Bush doesn't veto laws, but adds his input about them...why should that make me wary? It sounds like a president that cares about things, but wants to be fair.

Wow, that completely made me choke.

I think you should look into that a bit, Scott, especially in how it related to the McCain Detainee Amendment.

Yes, he cares...

So he was trying to expand what counts as permissable interrogation techniques? This is wrong...why?

ksolway wrote:

drowden wrote:

ksolway wrote:But the Islamic fundamentalists want Islamic law to rule the entire planet, and are ready to implement it given any opportunity. Are the Jewish fundamentalists of the same mindset? I doubt it.

Given the opportunity, yes, absolutely, yes. What do you think the Zionist movement in the US is all about?

Well I haven't heard anything about Jews wanting to wipe out and replace all non-Jewish religions,

http://www.moshiach.com

DHodges wrote:

Scott Schauland wrote:I just looked up signing statements. So Bush doesn't veto laws, but adds his input about them...why should that make me wary? It sounds like a president that cares about things, but wants to be fair.

Wow, that completely made me choke.

I think you should look into that a bit, Scott, especially in how it related to the McCain Detainee Amendment.

Yes, he cares...

I think George Bush being in office is an example of how stupid people really are. It should be obvious to anyone who values wisdom even the slightest bit that Bush embodies absolutely no wisdom. The fact that he is the president of the most powerful country in the world is proof that this country values wisdom as much as it values dog shit. The guy invades Iraq in the name of terrorism, when in fact all the terrorists came from Saudi Arabia (our allies). He also claims they have weapons of mass destruction (which were never found). So he decides to rename the war to Operation Iraqi Freedom. How stupid do Americans have to be to think this man is at all capable of running the country.

On top of that he has hasn't vetod a single bill except stem cell research. Arguably one of the greatest technological advancements in medical history. But he vetod it because of his religious beliefs. This guy is a moron. Of course he allows the "Patriot Act" to fly. Which basically took away most of America's rights to privay from the government. The name "Patriot Act" was genius, by the way, when it comes to making people affraid to challenge it because it might imply they are unpatriotic.

Ridiculous how people still believe it is republicans who want less government involvement, while the democrats want more government involvement. When Bush (a republican), has done plenty to increase government involvement in the affairs of every American's life. There's a big difference between what is said and what is happening. Anyone who thinks Bush knows whats best for this country, let alone the middle east, can be rightfully assumed to have little to no wisdom themselves.

I also find it ridiculous how American's think we are living in the greatest country in the world. Ironic isn't it, how I only hear this statement come from upper-middle class people, usually from caucasian descent. All one needs to do is drive down to your local ghetto and take a stroll through the other half of America. The half of America that is rampant with drugs, violence, and disease. Is it any wonder then why America ranks amongst the lowest in industrialized nations when it comes to health-care, infant fatalities, and things of that nature. Just look it up, you will see how much dirt is swept under the rug by our "unbiased media".

Here is a link that has to do with what I'm talking about:
http://develnet.org/ThisAndThat/DaddyWh ... AttackIraq

Nick,

I think George Bush being in office is an example of how stupid people really are.

I think whining about it is an example of how stupid people like you are. I'm not just being defensive here. Ray, that annoying poster a while ago, was right about at least this one thing - "politics is entertainment for the damned".

It should be obvious to anyone who values wisdom even the slightest bit that Bush embodies absolutely no wisdom.

Sure he's not a sage, but he is closer than Kerry or Gore ever were to embodying wisdom. At least he embodies masculinity. In fact, I think anyone who says Bush embodies absolutely no wisdom is way off. He may not seem intelligent, but any wise person should know how big of a difference there is between wisdom and intelligence. That's not to say he is unintelligent. That's only how he appears.

The fact that he is the president of the most powerful country in the world is proof that this country values wisdom as much as it values dog shit.

Everyone values wisdom, but it's hidden beneath other values. Everyone has that deep desire for wisdom whether they know it, and show it, or not.

I'd go so far as to say that a "lost society" is probably closer to wisdom than an intelligent society. But that's something that people who value intelligence won't easily grasp.

The guy invades Iraq in the name of terrorism, when in fact all the terrorists came from Saudi Arabia (our allies).

We also invaded Afghanistan. We were seeking out terrorist training camps, as well as infrastructures, in order to destroy them all. Of course we couldn't go into other countries due to the delicacy of diplomacy.

Think for a second...it doesn't matter where six people came from. It matters where every person like them comes from. If the US military went to the exact town where the terrorists of 9-11 came from and raided it, they wouldn't stop the threat which was posed on that day.

He also claims they have weapons of mass destruction (which were never found).

They were mostly moved to Syria. Some of Saddam's old higher ups came forward with the information. Old news...your argument is just the same old rehashed falseness.

Do you really think a big country in the middle east will have NO WMDs whatsoever? Yeah right!

So he decides to rename the war to Operation Iraqi Freedom.

Because that's what the war became. Just look at what most troops are doing over there now...it's mostly serving the Iraqi people. A waste of time and money in my opinion. Unless civil affairs and psyops actually know what they're doing.

How stupid do Americans have to be to think this man is at all capable of running the country.

Well, apparently not stupid at all, because he's been doing it for a few years now.

On top of that he has hasn't vetod a single bill except stem cell research. Arguably one of the greatest technological advancements in medical history. But he vetod it because of his religious beliefs.

I believe you can do stem cell research without abortion. Is that correct? Also, how is it a great technological advancement when nothing tangible has been accomplished by it? Hmm!

This guy is a moron. Of course he allows the "Patriot Act" to fly. Which basically took away most of America's rights to privay from the government. The name "Patriot Act" was genius, by the way, when it comes to making people affraid to challenge it because it might imply they are unpatriotic.

That's not the case at all...a lot of people have argued against it with sensible arguments. But it just depends on what the majority of people want...freedom to say anything without worrying about the FBI, or the freedom to walk the streets without worrying about your family and friends being blown apart by a car bomb.

There was just a supposed plot to detonate bombs at the Mackinac bridge in Michigan on labor day. Here's a picture:



Some of my extended family walk across it every year on that day. I'm glad the government can pay attention to what I do, so that I don't have to worry about these types of things happening a lot.

Besides, I just have to ask something to any opposer: do you have something to hide?

Ridiculous how people still believe it is republicans who want less government involvement, while the democrats want more government involvement. When Bush (a republican), has done plenty to increase government involvement in the affairs of every American's life. There's a big difference between what is said and what is happening. Anyone who thinks Bush knows whats best for this country, let alone the middle east, can be rightfully assumed to have little to no wisdom themselves.

How is the government involved in my day to day life...well...they aren't, beyond my military contract. So I don't see your point.

I also find it ridiculous how American's think we are living in the greatest country in the world. Ironic isn't it, how I only hear this statement come from upper-middle class people, usually from caucasian descent. All one needs to do is drive down to your local ghetto and take a stroll through the other half of America. The half of America that is rampant with drugs, violence, and disease. Is it any wonder then why America ranks amongst the lowest in industrialized nations when it comes to health-care, infant fatalities, and things of that nature. Just look it up, you will see how much dirt is swept under the rug by our "unbiased media".

Everything we do in the US is up to us. If we want to get more money, we take it. If we are too stupid to do so, then we live in ghettos, do drugs, commit crimes and violence, and get sick. Sure, it sucks, but if you want the government to get involved in that you're going to be out of luck until a democrat comes into office.

And when that happens our freedom will diminish a bit.

sschaula wrote:Dan,

Do you know how many Xians, all told, have committed "terrorist" acts on US soil over the years?

No. So I looked it up on wikipedia (the greatest thing ever invented)...

Wikipedia is certainly a great resource, but on issues that might contain a degree of controversy I highly recommend checking corroberative sources before forming an opinion. As an aside, in don't know if anyone's noticed, but most of the Wiki pages to do with the middle east have been shut down to editing due to vandalism. Sad but strangly funny at the same time. Might be just me though...

Examples of attacks and aggression

As David Hodges mentioned, you have to include the actviity of an oranisation like the KKK in that list. But I was really speaking about terrorism on US soil specifically. In that sense I'd include an organisation like the Waco Whackos, even though they got killed themselves before they were able to do anything stupid to others. You also have the multitudes of anti-government home grown militia movements who have the potential to wreak havoc at any time, but no-one seems to worry too much about them, presumably because they're "patriots" and as we know patriots would never do anything really bad.

Does that really compare to what we're seeing with Islam? Sure, it's stupid shit...but it isn't nearly as dangerous or as widespread.

In terms of direct threat to the US, I think your home grown dipshits are far more of an immediate threat than Islamic dipshits. Plus I also think you have to include your own government in that in the sense that wars that need not be fought and should never have been fought (i.e. Iraq) have thus far killed fast heading towards 3,000 US citizens and screwed up the lives of nearly 18,000 of them (and that's just the soldiers).

Dan: Or is that one of those facts of your own nation that you don't know about like "Signing Statements"?

Scott: I just looked up signing statements. So Bush doesn't veto laws, but adds his input about them...why should that make me wary? It sounds like a president that cares about things, but wants to be fair.

Hmm, that's an interesting way to look at it I guess. Not everyone agrees however. You may want to look at this stuff I posted elsewhere: Signing Statements

Dan: You scare me sometimes, Scott. Mostly because you are typical of Americans who don't know who the real enemy is...or want to consider there are more immediate ones than Muslims.

Scott: Sure, there are more immediate ones than fanatical Muslims. There are bad people that live in America...probably right down the street from me. They could break in and kill me. If I walk down the streets of a major city, there are enemies closer than fanatical Muslims. Some people have wanted to cause me harm just because they don't like who I am...the vibes they got from me or something. The only thing that's stopped them, in my opinion, is that they can sense on some level that they'd quickly get payback, ten thousand fold, for anything done to myself, my friends or my family.

But that doesn't take away from the fact that fanatical Muslims ARE a major enemy. More of a threat than anyone I know.

I'm not sure that exactly follows. Yes, they are a potential threat, but when you look at the actual facts there has only been 9/11, and that was 5 years ago. Thousands of illegals have been flooding into the US over its southern borders for years now, and seemingly the Muslim fundies haven't been smart enough to take advantage of that and wreak havoc. In terms of an actual US-soil threat, I don't think fundie Muslims are really as much of a clear and present danger as is being suggested. But that isn't to say that US security organisations shouldn't be on the ball and looking out for potential problems. I do, and have always nominally supported the so-called "war" on terror. It's just some of its strategies and consequences that I take issue with.

Show me a more dangerous and relevant threat. My government? Yeah right. I can live free in my country and they don't bother me.

What, not even the IRS? Lucky guy.

Dan: As a single, non-domestic example, try Googling "5 dancing Israelis" and get back to me..

Scott: So Mossad agents probably knew about the attack before hand, and took photos and videos of it.

Yes, doesn't that scare the shit out of you? Your own ally, a nation to whom you are a significant benefactor was likely complicit in the worst terrorist event in your history (knowing and not telling makes oen complicity inn my view). I for one would be demanding that the truth of such activities came out and not hidden away under the bullshit rubric of "classified" information.

What I don't like about reading these things is that they all try to begin to claim that 9-11 was planned by Zionist elements of the US government. I think that kind of propoganda is retarded.

I don't find it retarded in and of itself. I find it entirely possible. I presume you've heard of Operation Northwoods? But the theories just don't have enough evidence for them to be taken seriously. There is no evidence that we know of, for example, that those Israeli's or any of the others arrested before and after 9/11 were involved in anything other than information gathgering. I still say, however, that the very real possility that Mossad and Israel knew of the impending attack, right down to quite explit detail is something deeply disturbing in and of istelf.

Dan Rowden

Tharan wrote:Perhaps you never heard Dan and Naturyl's rant about the 9/11 conspiracies, Scott. Maybe Dan could be so kind as to summarize for us.

This thread isn't the place for that. I am a LIHOP advocate, yes. I think the evidence for that is considerable.

But there is truth in what he says about the progressives and thinking people of Isreal leaving the area. At my last position, I made friends with a woman who joined the faculty of our department who came from Isreal for that very reason. And it is instances such as these that, as Kevin said, the state may fail. That would be cause for dancing in the streets, would it not, Dan and Leyla and Marsha?

Israel will fall!! Inshallah!! Allahu Akbar! Allahu Akbar! Subhaana ala humma wa bihamdika wa tabaara kasmuka wa ta'aalaa jadduka wa laa ilaaha ghairuk Allahu Akbar!

Shit, forgot to face east. Allahu Akbar!!!!

was it the Velvet Underground. What a mob of idiots they were

I don't know. I think we put out a few good recordings in our time. I still see Lou Reed every now and then and, of course, we all miss Andy.

Faizi

Tharan actually wrote:

That would be cause for dancing in the streets, would it not, Dan and Leyla and Marsha?

Right. The one I really like is that Muslim Swim dance you see them doing on television whenever an American helicopter gets downed or whatever other thing. Like Dan and Leyla, I am just waiting for Israel to bite the dust so I can do the Muslim Swim or Watusi thing.

You know what really gets me about that, Tharan? It is the fact that you have not read what I have written. I never said that I am against Israel or that I want it to be destroyed. What I have said is that Israel is often just as barbarous as the others and I think it is important for people to be aware of this, rather than just simply believing that all Israelis are good and on our side and like us; while all Muslims -- even those who are liberal or moderate in their interpretation of the religion -- are really just Jihadists under the veil.

Faizi

MKFaizi wrote:Tharan actually wrote:

That would be cause for dancing in the streets, would it not, Dan and Leyla and Marsha?

Right. The one I really like is that Muslim Swim dance you see them doing on television whenever an American helicopter gets downed or whatever other thing. Like Dan and Leyla, I am just waiting for Israel to bite the dust so I can do the Muslim Swim or Watusi thing.

You know what really gets me about that, Tharan? It is the fact that you have not read what I have written. I never said that I am against Israel or that I want it to be destroyed. What I have said is that Israel is often just as barbarous as the others and I think it is important for people to be aware of this, rather than just simply believing that all Israelis are good and on our side and like us; while all Muslims -- even those who are liberal or moderate in their interpretation of the religion -- are really just Jihadists under the veil.

Faizi

Exactly, I fear, jews, muslims, and catholics. But I have the goods on all of them. Now they work for me. My name is Charlie.

drowden wrote:Scott: So Mossad agents probably knew about the attack before hand, and took photos and videos of it.

Yes, doesn't that scare the shit out of you? Your own ally, a nation to whom you are a significant benefactor was likely complicit in the worst terrorist event in your history

I think you're getting far too carried away when there's not enough evidence. It is possible they had intercepted a rumour or a threat. They may or may not have passed on this information to US intelligence. There is simply too little hard evidence to be drawing such wild accusations as "likely complicit in the worst terrorist event in your history".

millipodium wrote:http://www.moshiach.com

There are thousands of cults in the world. Why isn't this just another one of them? I don't see anything particularly frightening about yet another small group of loonies.

[Edit: Also, I didn't see anything on the site that was on a different order of delusion than that of the average born-again Christian. I didn't see any immediate plans for nuclear offensives, etc. So it looks relatively harmless to me.]

ksolway wrote:

drowden wrote:Scott: So Mossad agents probably knew about the attack before hand, and took photos and videos of it.

Yes, doesn't that scare the shit out of you? Your own ally, a nation to whom you are a significant benefactor was likely complicit in the worst terrorist event in your history

I think you're getting far too carried away when there's not enough evidence. It is possible they had intercepted a rumour or a threat. They may or may not have passed on this information to US intelligence. There is simply too little hard evidence to be drawing such wild accusations as "likely complicit in the worst terrorist event in your history".

Oh, hang on! How come you're allowed to engage in factless, wild speculation and I'm not? Doesn't seem fair. You're just trying to oppress me. You are quite the Jew, Kevin. Plus I'm not sure why you think there is actually insufficient evidence to reasonably speculate that those guys knew in advance. I wouldn't have speculated such a thing if I hadn't first followed the evidence trail. It's not like their actions and arrest are a conspiracy theory.