GENIUS FORUMS

Dan, thanx for the support. The power is in my not having to invest emotions & time building a failed relationship. The forum TWATS are getting all histrionic just because they fear being replaced by whores, so they make a bogeyman out of me, scapegoating me as an abberation to be despised, rather than seeing me for what I am: a nice successful guy fed up with women's addiction to bitchy personal drama.

Carmel wrote:Dan:

Indeed. Nevertheless, the discussion has mostly been gratuitous tangents somewhat transparently designed to impugn his character, when that is hardly necessary. Why not just limit the scope of the discussion to the moral dimensions applicable to what he's actually doing? Could we do that? I'd be all for it, really.

Carmel:
Sure Dan, I'd be all for it too. I'd also be all for not being callled a "twat" by pierdog and prefer that he stopped making unsubstantiated ad hominen attacks against women. Can he do that? can he? Really, that would be terrific.

I suspect he feels dishonored and mischaracterised by all the tangents the discussion has taken. i.e. those tangents provide an implicit reflection on his character that isn't necessary. If it was me I'd feel kind of miffed by it too; but then, I wouldn't use his provocative rhetoric so my sympathy is somewhat diminished thereby.

Dan:
Ah, sexual power dynamics! Now you're talkin'! Actually, it's debatable that it does this. You realise, right, that his need for female attention places the power with the woman?

Carmel:
Yes, I realize this, but it's his "need" which should be the object of discussion. If he wants to continue to give his power away to women, then fine, but he needs to man up and stop blaming women for his own weakness.

Can you point to what he's said that indicates that he a) does not know he is giving up power via his needs; b) is blaming women for his weakness/powerlessness? i.e. in the specific context of his need for sexual congress. I like the word "congress", given that Congress are such fuckers. That's probably not funny either...

Dan:
You realise as well that many, perhaps most prostitutes intuitively know this? i.e. women generally intuitively know this?

Carmel:
yes, women know that many men are slaves to their animal instincts...but, here's a secret. Women find men sexy. Do you guys really not know this? Not all of the power lies with the women.

This is true enough. Both sexes relinquish, yet, simultaneously possess power through their own needs and that of the needs of the other. It's a complex game of submission and exploitation. Maybe that's why I've never had that much time for it - too much like hard work. But in the case of professional sex workers, the power is pretty much one way (or, perhaps it's better to say the relinquishment is one way).

Dan:
Well, I sometimes feel like slapping hysterical women too. Men as well, for that matter, but those buggers can hit back even harder...

Carmel:
yes, I can relate to this. I sometimes feel like smacking Diebert when he inundates me with his convoluted evasions, girlish prose and duplicitous speech. :)

Well, I thought Diebert was right to chastise you for needless tangential posturing. But, I ain't gettin' in the middle of your little tiff :)

Dan:
As for his whoring, well, that is a consequence of his need for female contact, which would include not just the pleasure of sex but things like validation and all that jazz. Men who use prostitutes are most emphatically not in a position of power.

Carmel:
I agree completely that he is not in a position of power, but does he know that?

I suspect he does. If he didn't before, he ought to now.

pierdog:

Dan, thanx for the support.

Carmel:
Dan doesn't support ad hominen attacks. He supports logical debate.

pierdog
The power is in my not having to invest emotions & time building a failed relationship. The forum TWATS are getting all histrionic just because they fear being replaced by whores, so they make a bogeyman out of me, scapegoating me as an abberation to be despised, rather than seeing me for what I am: a nice successful guy fed up with women's addiction to bitchy personal drama.

Carmel:
This is not an example of logical debate. It's essentially an ad hominen attack. You're the one who is engaging in histrionics with this sort of irrationality. Try using logic, instead of trollish name calling...or are you incapable of this as I accused you of previously? Perhaps, you'd be better suited to youtube where trolling is welcome.

pierdog wrote:Dan, thanx for the support. The power is in my not having to invest emotions & time building a failed relationship. The forum TWATS are getting all histrionic just because they fear being replaced by whores, so they make a bogeyman out of me, scapegoating me as an abberation to be despised, rather than seeing me for what I am: a nice successful guy fed up with women's addiction to bitchy personal drama.

Er, my "support" isn't unqualified by any means. I frankly don't find your provocative language helpful, nor calling people twats. But then, unflattering titles have been flung your way, so..... meh.

I have no problem with you using prostitutes if you are respectful. That said, I think your need for them (or women per se) is an issue you might want to look at, but that's a big program for any man to enter into. You seem to indicate you're not ready for that yet. That's at least honest.

dejavu wrote:

Kelly: ...In other words, neither of them were actually degraded by their status, one as prostitute, the other as murderer, but were able to see a deeper reality: that they themselves had a higher morality through accepting the dysfunctionality of their society, than those who fitted-in to it and claimed to be "clean" and "moral".

What better example of banality can now be found in this thread? Crime and Punishment is definitely a tale of societal disease, and of chance, ... it's not a romance !

That's odd. I viewed my note as a simple illustration of the straightforward relationship between those who create a true morality by rejecting standard societal norms. It seemed rather obvious to me. I thought it showed a parallel to pierdog's status vis-a-vis the band of moral high-horse trotters. But of course, you can call it banal, romantic, etc. and totally miss out on the goods.

Kelly wrote:Explain how my decision to become enlightened and help others become enlightened deliberately aims to satisfy a psychiatrist's desires, rather than the opposite. Explain how a psychiatrist's inability to reason, or to recognise the importance of wisdom, is what my life aims to support and promote, rather than the opposite. If you can't do this, then you don't have a leg to stand on.

lol
Did you consider getting a second opinion? There's more than one practicing psychologist in the sea. I'm surprised at the extent to which this seems to irk you. There is only one thing I take back, and that is my saying I don't like your face. I am not in a position to really decide that until I see you smile!

It doesn't irk me. It is another simple, clear, attractive illustration of the schism between people who get on their moral high-horses with the quickest eagerness, and the social reject. You were foolish enough to jump in there without thinking, and, as I predicted, having seen the mistakes you make, are now backing out pretending that you were joking. Please exert yourself to think about your ideas, and whether they are valid and supportable, before you publish them. If you continue to waste other people's time, then you don't deserve to have room made for you here. Please, do make an effort. Promote a love of reason.

Regarding having one opinion only, you must have made that error because you don't know anything about the disability pension application process. But in that case, you ought to have recognised your lack of experience, and not jumped to a conclusion. Take reasoning seriously, and you stop making mistakes (or reduce the number dramatically). Otherwise, it's really discourteous to make other people mop up after you.

I met with about 5 medical professionals, with varying qualifications in mental health treatment, throughout the application process. I have since met with four or more, and I can generally say that none of them understood. All of them were men. Three stood out as far more rational and conscious than the others, but even so, still did not understand, and did not want to understand, my interest in personal, non-academic, high-level reasoning on philosophical matters. They regarded it as aberrant behaviour, albeit with melancholy and indicating personal regret.

.

@ Caramel -- The idea that your negativity toward me is the result of being threatened with obsolecence is NOT ad hominen for the simple reason that pgs 1, 2 & 3 are dedicated to explaining the consensual, respectful, mutual & non-exploitive nature of the relationship and my extensive past with women in general. It's not ad hominem, it's deduction: my twatty detractors like Caramel fear being replaced by whores.

[quote="pierdog"]@ Caramel -- The idea that your negativity toward me

Carmel:
I don't feel negatively toward you. I simply think you're boring and detracting from the goals of this forum.

pierdog:
is the result of being threatened with obsolecence is NOT ad hominen for the simple reason that pgs 1, 2 & 3 are dedicated to explaining the consensual, respectful, mutual & non-exploitive nature of the relationship and my extensive past with women in general. It's not ad hominem, it's deduction: my twatty detractors like Caramel fear being replaced by whores.

Carmel:
Name calling is an ad hominen attack. "twatty" "twat". It's a rhetorical device used by irrational boys like you who are incapable of logical debate. Any questions?

and no, I wouldn't be attracted to a whoremonger like you, so your deduction is woefully inaccurate. I prefer men with a modicum of self control and who focus on higher pursuits. So, no worries, carry on with your whoring. :)

LOL @ Caramel! I had to laugh because after reading her post, the first paragraph of Dejavu's post was quite fitting and I'd add: also backed up by the ancients, philosophers and players.

Diebert:
You've no idea how pitch black it is where I'm swimming. Your hinting at some tinted currents mean nothing to me.

Carmel:
What is this about? This comment seems out of character for you.

Any MAN who replies to anything this twat Caramel writes and takes her seriously even after having read the content of this thread - is a fucking joke.

pierdog wrote:Any MAN who replies to anything this twat Caramel writes and takes her seriously even after having read the content of this thread - is a fucking joke.

Trust you to not recognise an intelligent, authentic woman when you see one. It's all about diminishment with you - push her down to raise yourself up. It's kind of sad... anyway, better to feel sadness than contempt.

It's about pointing out the obvious followed by what Dan Rowden was quoted by Dejavu as saying.

Carmel wrote: It's too much ugly, reality for you to face the oppression of fellow human beings. Some of the slaves are young boys...do you care now, or are you dead inside?

And all this because I was commenting on the general disability to be honest about ones nature in women and feminized men. Which didn't equate women with whores nor did it comment on the exact state of prostitution in your neighborhood. But nobody payed that much attention, I'm afraid.

Carmel wrote:Diebert:
You've no idea how pitch black it is where I'm swimming. Your hinting at some tinted currents mean nothing to me.

Carmel:
What is this about? This comment seems out of character for you.

Your question seems to explain some of your slightly hysterical(!) responses lately, voicing an undertone of surprise, frustration or disappointment in my approaches. But my remark was meant as a reminder that I'm not interested in any ethics here. They are worthless as argument. If Charles Manson logged on and voiced some insights in between his rants, I'd still listen and work with the good stuff. It's just not an issue to me what people need to do with their life or other lives in the context of this forum. Every statement is weighed on its ability to stand up as truthful. If it would be different, I couldn't communicate here at all: you're all "darker currents" where I'm concerned. And it's pitch black here.

Carmel wrote:Dan:
Well, I sometimes feel like slapping hysterical women too. Men as well, for that matter, but those buggers can hit back even harder...

Carmel:
yes, I can relate to this. I sometimes feel like smacking Diebert when he inundates me with his convoluted evasions, girlish prose and duplicitous speech. :)

Dan can get away with so much. I need to learn how he does it so I don't have to wade through all the shit every time I open my mouth on women.

My plan is:

1. practice my voice to be as deep and pleasantly resonating, weakening feminine resistance
2. make youtube videos with a string of pretty pictures... women are suckers for pretty pics - second to flowers
3. gazing with puppy eyes and a helpless boyish cheeky face into a webcam playing on the female care instinct
4. working further on my dry humor and wit a bit

Any other ideas?

pierdog wrote:The forum TWATS are getting all histrionic just because they fear being replaced by whores

In a way this is surprisingly insightful.

Diebert van Rhijn wrote:Dan can get away with so much. I need to learn how he does it so I don't have to wade through all the shit every time I open my mouth on women.

My plan is:

1. practice my voice to be as deep and pleasantly resonating, weakening feminine resistance
2. make youtube videos with a string of pretty pictures... women are suckers for pretty pics - second to flowers
3. gazing with puppy eyes and a helpless boyish cheeky face into a webcam playing on the female care instinct
4. working further on my dry humor and wit a bit

lol... I'm not laughing at you Dan, it's just I find Diebert's take on it here kind of amusing. :)

Diebert van Rhijn wrote:Any other ideas?

If you had a genuine desire not to be the target of people's aggression over this subject matter, the guidance of your intuition is probably 100 times more effective than making a list about how to do it.

Nick Treklis wrote:

Dan Rowden wrote:The forum TWATS are getting all histrionic just because they fear being replaced by whores

Nick:
In a way this is surprisingly insightful.

Carmel:
Nick, You misquoted Dan. The trollish kid said that. I already pointed out the logical fallacies of his statement. Most women aren't attracted to bigots and whoremongers, so it's really a moot point, or least for me personally.

--

Diebert,
Dan "gets away with a lot" because he's not a bigot. He's easily one of the most fair minded men here with regard to women. Trust me, if he weren't, I would be the first one to point it out to him.

Carry on wayward sons...

Nick:

If you had a genuine desire not to be the target of people's aggression over this subject matter, the guidance of your intuition is probably 100 times more effective than making a list about how to do it.[/quote]

Carmel:
ok, that was redemptive, excellent point, Nick. :)

Carmel wrote:Nick, You misquoted Dan.

Ah thanks. It's fixed.

Carmel wrote:The trollish kid said that, so I'm not surprised that you would agree.

I hope you're not trying to deliberately twist my words around, and that this was just a poorly timed knee jerk reaction to what I actually said.

Carmel wrote:Most women aren't attracted to bigots and whoremongers, so it's really a moot point, or least for me personally.

Well, I think what I quoted of pierdog speaks to why so many women feel that way about men who seek the services of prostitutes, which is why I said it was in a way surprisingly insightful. Personally, I have a friend who enjoys doing business with prostitutes and escorts, and I have to say that the girlfriends of some of my other friends find him disgusting. I find it unfair of them to view him like that, and the only reason I can come up with as to why they find him disgusting is that they probably fear that if their boyfriends can go get sex somewhere else for just a couple hundred bucks without having to put up with all their bullshit, they might leave them, resulting in them losing their status in society as an "exclusive couple". Plus it brings to the surface some of the same whorish dynamics going on within their own relationships, e.g. the fact that they all use sex as leverage to get certain things out of their boyfriends and society as a whole.

Nick:
I hope you're not trying to deliberately twist my words around, and that this was just a poorly timed knee jerk reaction to what I actually said.

Carmel:
It was a bit like that, yes, -no offense meant. I edited my post.

Nick:
Well, I think what I quoted of pierdog speaks to why so many women feel that way about men who seek the services of prostitutes, which is why I said it was in a way surprisingly insightful. Personally, I have a friend who enjoys doing business with prostitutes and escorts, and I have to say that the girlfriends of some of my other friends find him disgusting. I find it unfair of them to view him like that, and the only reason I can come up with as to why they find him disgusting is because they fear it would result in them no longer having the same standing within society, and it brings to the surface some of the same whorish dynamics going on within their own relationships, e.g. the fact that they all use sex as leverage to get certain things out of their boyfriends and society as a whole.[/quote]

Carmel:
Actually, no that's not quite what I meant. It has nothing to do with social standing. It more personal than that. I simply meant that I get a negative "feeling" on a visceral level about men who are bigots, or obsessive about sex, pathological etc. It's not about morality or power dynamics, status etc. so, therefore, a bigot/whoremonger unevolved type of man wouldn't be attractive to me, thus rendering the "whore" a non issue, as far as "competition" goes. Does that make sense?

Before I respond I just want to let you know I edited my last post, so what you quoted of me is slightly different from what I changed it to.

Diebert van Rhijn wrote:Dan can get away with so much. I need to learn how he does it so I don't have to wade through all the shit every time I open my mouth on women.

My plan is:

1. practice my voice to be as deep and pleasantly resonating, weakening feminine resistance
2. make youtube videos with a string of pretty pictures... women are suckers for pretty pics - second to flowers
3. gazing with puppy eyes and a helpless boyish cheeky face into a webcam playing on the female care instinct
4. working further on my dry humor and wit a bit

Any other ideas?

Take up karaoke. His sister, Jeannie, let on that that's his hobby at the pubs. Very masculine..

Carmel wrote:I simply meant that I get a negative "feeling" on a visceral level about men who are bigots, or obsessive about sex, pathological etc. It's not about morality or power dynamics, status etc. Does that make sense?

Well, I don't think it's intellectually honest because this feeling you get on a visceral level is no doubt a result of how you perceive the nature of prostitution on a more cerebral level. So perhaps you could delve a little more into the cerebral interpretation, rather than the resulting feeling.

Personally I don't have a taste for prostitutes for a few different reasons, e.g. health concerns and the need to be emotionally attached to the person I'm having sex with. But on the surface I don't have any objection to others engaging in prostitution. In fact I often find the relationship between a man and a prostitute much more honest, and thus more respectable than that of many of the "relationships" I've witnessed. Does this make sense?

Carmel wrote:so, therefore, a bigot/whoremonger unevolved type of man wouldn't be attractive to me, thus rendering the "whore" a non issue, as far as "competition" goes.

Ok this gets a little more into explaining why you wouldn't be attracted to a man who has a taste for prostitutes, but I still don't see how this would justify you regarding a man as a bigot just because he does have a taste for them. To me it's just a matter of personal preference, and not worth getting upset about.