GENIUS FORUMS

Cahoot wrote:Actually, just as we are born perfect, we are born with freedom of speech and thought.

It's a freedom that cannot be given by man.

Man can take that freedom away, though. From himself, and from others.

cousinbasil wrote:I'm not sure how you are using the word "perfect" here, ...

Cahoot wrote:

Glostik91 wrote:

Cahoot wrote:Actually, just as we are born perfect, we are born with freedom of speech and thought.

It's a freedom that cannot be given by man.

Man can take that freedom away, though. From himself, and from others.

If man can take it away, then certainly it can be given by man.

And if man can take away this freedom before birth then I suppose perfection is also robbed.

Taken from the child and given to the man in charge.

If I interpreted your statements correctly that is.

When man puts a turtle in a cage, he takes away the turtle’s freedom.
When man puts a dove in a cage, he takes away the dove’s freedom.

When man releases the dove, the dove is free to fly.

If the act of releasing is the power that gives the dove the freedom to fly,
then the same act of releasing gives the turtle the freedom to fly.

Will the turtle fly?

No.

*

But it does have the freedom to crawl off a cliff, and although for a short while the turtle may feel like it’s flying, actually its falling.

The man who took away the turtle’s freedom to fly may pick the turtle up and throw it through the air, but this is not giving the turtle freedom to fly. It is just giving the turtle another experience of falling, and besides, it is cruel to throw turtles.

The turtle also has the freedom to build an airplane, extract and refine the fuel to fly the airplane, and thus fly in that sense. But this is not likely to happen, since the turtle’s legs are too short to reach the controls.

The turtle also has the freedom to crawl onto a plane that man has built and fueled and thus fly in that way, but actually the turtle is just exercising its freedom to crawl into another cage, and when the plane leaves the ground the turtle in his cage is flying only in the sense that it is flying when standing on the earth. But this is not likely to happen, since the turtle would not get past the airport security checks without a ticket, and because it’s a well-known fact that turtles don’t carry photo ID.

look at that escargot

GodsDaughter1 wrote:

Cahoot wrote:

Glostik91 wrote:

Cahoot wrote:Actually, just as we are born perfect, we are born with freedom of speech and thought.

It's a freedom that cannot be given by man.

Man can take that freedom away, though. From himself, and from others.

If man can take it away, then certainly it can be given by man.

And if man can take away this freedom before birth then I suppose perfection is also robbed.

Taken from the child and given to the man in charge.

If I interpreted your statements correctly that is.

When man puts a turtle in a cage, he takes away the turtle’s freedom.
When man puts a dove in a cage, he takes away the dove’s freedom.

When man releases the dove, the dove is free to fly.

If the act of releasing is the power that gives the dove the freedom to fly,
then the same act of releasing gives the turtle the freedom to fly.

Will the turtle fly?

No.

*

But it does have the freedom to crawl off a cliff, and although for a short while the turtle may feel like it’s flying, actually its falling.

The man who took away the turtle’s freedom to fly may pick the turtle up and throw it through the air, but this is not giving the turtle freedom to fly. It is just giving the turtle another experience of falling, and besides, it is cruel to throw turtles.

The turtle also has the freedom to build an airplane, extract and refine the fuel to fly the airplane, and thus fly in that sense. But this is not likely to happen, since the turtle’s legs are too short to reach the controls.

The turtle also has the freedom to crawl onto a plane that man has built and fueled and thus fly in that way, but actually the turtle is just exercising its freedom to crawl into another cage, and when the plane leaves the ground the turtle in his cage is flying only in the sense that it is flying when standing on the earth. But this is not likely to happen, since the turtle would not get past the airport security checks without a ticket, and because it’s a well-known fact that turtles don’t carry photo ID.

look at that escargot

GodsDaughter says: The question is will the turtle ever fly, no because turtles are not inclined to fly, but, what will encourage the turtle to fly like Johnathan Livingston Seagul? The turtle flys better than any bird, for it dares to be different, lets not forget the story about the turtle and the hare, the turtle won the race, but the moral of this story is when you're different there is no racism, there is only acceptance of that difference, so with this knowledge even turtles fly and they win!