GENIUS FORUMS

Carl G wrote:There is plenty of evidence for alien presence here on earth.

I have to agree with Carl on this one. Here's the evidence.

So, do you suppose that wheat is actually intelligent plant life, is reading the communications that we are trying to send to space, and just bending over on their own accord to communicate with us? Is wheat perhaps a superior life form to us, so we should quit eating it? Are nuts a lower life form to wheat? Perhaps we should eat more nuts. Soylent green, anyone?

CONFESSIONS OF A CROP CIRCLE MAKER

Caryn: You have a number of critics, how do you normally respond to them?

John: I don’t. I think you learn very quickly as a circlemaker that entering into any discourse about your work with someone who has invested belief in it is an ultimately fruitless pursuit. The circlemakers and the crop circle researchers - or followers - have a very symbiotic relationship. We need each other - not that any crop circle researcher would ever admit that. They act as agents for our work, propagating the images across the globe, and more importantly weaving complex ever evolving and shifting narratives about the non-human origin of the circles. They come up with litmus tests that become an article of faith for them, terms such as ‘bent not broken stems’, ‘physiological changed to the plants’, etc are their ‘proof’ that the circles could not possibly be the work of mere human mortals. I think this attitude shows a complete lack of belief in human potential. Do these people not look around them and see what human civilization has achieved? The scientific, engineering and artistic marvels? We can get a man to the moon and back, but these people can’t believe that a few well organised artists can flatten cereal crops in a complex pattern. Of course within the same community there are those that don’t believe we ever sent men to moon.

prince wrote:True.., maybe they just have a really fucked-up sense of humour and like to play good cop / bad cop with us gullible humans.

Maybe they've always been with us, those things out there. Maybe they love it, seeing us hate each other, watching us kill each other off, feeding on our own cold fucking hearts.

Look around us the environment we live in carbon dioxide, fluorocarbons and methane have increased since 1958. Earth is being acclimatized. They are turning our atmosphere into their atmosphere. It's in their best interests, they are free enterprisers. The earth is just another developing planet; their third world. We are like a natural resource to them; deplete the planet move on to another. They want benign indifference. They want us drugged. We could be pets, we could be food, but all we really are is livestock.

Our impulses are being redirected. We are living in an artificially induced state of consciousness that resembles sleep. The poor and the underclass are growing. Racial justice and human rights are nonexistent. They have created a repressive society and we are their unwitting accomplices. Their intention to rule rests with the annihilation of consciousness. We have been lulled into a trance. They have made us indifferent, to ourselves, and to others. We are focused only on our own gain. Please understand they are safe as long as they are not discovered. That is their primary method of survival. Keep us asleep. Keep us selfish. Keep us sedated. They are dismantling the sleeping middle class. More and more people are becoming poor. We are their cattle. We are being bred for slavery. Resist them.

It's business, that's all it is. You still don't get it. There ain't no countries anymore. They're running the whole show. They own the whole planet. They can do whatever they want. We can have it good for a change. If we help them, they'll leave us alone to make some money. You can have a taste of the good life. It's what everybody wants.

What's the threat? We all sell out every day, might as well be on the winning team.

See you, boys.

--John Carpenter's "They Live"

.

prince wrote:

Nick Treklis wrote:How does equating the idea that "humans make crop circles" with the idea that "DNA and the Universe is an "accident" make any sense? Is this some sort of subconscious tendency of yours coming to the surface, e.g. that anything humans do is merely an "accident" as opposed to the constructive creation demonstrated by your god?

They are not directly related, I was simply expanding on your cynicism.

Q: How is not believing in an explanation without evidence cynical? A: It's not. You just don't like others debunking your fairy tales.

prince wrote:My point being, dismissing crop circles as man made, is similar to concluding that the universe is just an accident, or 'man-made' if you like, ie. having no purpose other than what man decides it has. That is a fundamental error of logic.

All things arise due to cause effect, crop circles and the observable universe are no exceptions. If we want to understand the immediate causes of these things we have to investigate them openly and honestly without jumping to conclusions that lack sound evidence. Also, viewing man being an immediate cause of something as an accident is completely irrational. If you want to view man made things as accidents, that only speaks to how you view things, and it certainly doesn't seem like you're viewing things in a reasonable manner. And as for purpose, the only thing we know for sure that operates with purpose in this universe is man because we posses consciousness. Purpose means nothing outside consciousness, so it makes no sense to imply that something can have a purpose other than what we decide.

prince wrote: The coherent capacities of the human mind is a result of recognition of coherence by design, it can not be any other way.

Yes, I know you are a creationist Prince, i.e. a believer in fairy tales.

prince wrote:Probably, but software does not write itself from scratch, that's my point.

I thought your point was that me having no belief in paranormal explanations for crop circles was akin to not believing humans are the writers of all software. Either way, it's a terrible analogy.

My point being, dismissing crop circles as man made, is similar to concluding that the universe is just an accident, or 'man-made' if you like, ie. having no purpose other than what man decides it has. That is a fundamental error of logic.

Oh. So, how is it that aliens, equally, are established as not being "man-made"?

Leyla, WTF is your new avatar? Micro-porn?

edit to correct spelling

Looks like shes wearing a burkini!

No, Nick, the burkini sports full coverage. What's depicted looks more like a naked woman in a hangman's hood and cuffs, and black high heels.

Latest Crop Circle Sighting! They are taking this one so seriously that even the secret service is investigating.

Hi, Elizabeth. How's it going?

Please see the "Woman as Friend" thread in Genius for a reply.

Nick - ha!

Nick Treklis wrote:I thought your point was that me having no belief in paranormal explanations for crop circles was akin to not believing humans are the writers of all software. Either way, it's a terrible analogy.

Admittedly I was a tad vague...hence the analogy flew over your head (no pun intended)

The analogy is between computer software, and human DNA.

DNA is a set of instructions, a string of code. In turn, that code, when executed produces a human, an intelligent thing. In turn, human created computers, modeled on the way the brain works (the created bears the fingerprints of the creator)

The brain however, is significantly more capable and refined than any man-made computer.

It's absolutely logical, (if you can bypass the delusion that one is a result of fortuitous events, which is ego-driven
and therefore intrinsically false), to conclude that the DNA code, was in a like fashion modeled by an even greater intelligence. This is easily understood, if you utilize your own intelligence to the full.

You can recognize a computer is man-made, but can't recognize that a human is also made by something purposefully,
because you are not yet aware of what you are, and what you are not. What you are not, is the field of awareness which creates the perimeter around what you are, that being which created you as a functioning aspect of itself, but in a
subservient role. Your role, your purpose is to act in an intelligent and inquisitive manner, to discover that which is self-evident, just as the superior intelligence does itself, by its very nature.

God is essentially a computer, each human is a unique subroutine that manifests itself as a chemical apparatus. The reason being, God wishes to remain immortal, so does not transmute itself directly into the chemical realm (except on one occasion) but is able to infinitely manifest chemical designs by manipulating the density of energy fields.

prince: your thoughts flew over my mind buddy. brilliantly explained theory.

prince wrote: The analogy is between computer software, and human DNA.

Ok?

prince wrote: DNA is a set of instructions, a string of code. In turn, that code, when executed produces a human, an intelligent thing.

Wrong. DNA is not executed like a computer program. Sexual intercourse and the combination of a sperm cell and an ovum leads to the development of an embryo which may or may not develop into a human who may or may not be intelligent depending on the presence of genetic disorders and the safety of the environment.

prince wrote: In turn, human created computers, modeled on the way the brain works (the created bears the fingerprints of the creator)

.

Wrong. Humans do not fully understand how the brain functions, so even if they wanted to they couldn't design a computer completely based on it.

prince wrote: The brain however, is significantly more capable and refined than any man-made computer.

Wrong. Computers are far more powerful than the brain in many aspects. Computers solve complex math equations instantaneously, they've even better the best chess player in the world. Computers can potentially do everything better than humans at this point, aside from producing consciousness.

prince wrote:(if you can bypass the delusion that one is a result of fortuitous events, which is ego-driven
and therefore intrinsically false),

There is no evidence supporting the idea that evolution was a result of some intelligent force. To believe anything other than this is akin to believing in fairy tales.

prince wrote:It's absolutely logical, to conclude that the DNA code, was in a like fashion modeled by an even greater intelligence. This is easily understood, if you utilize your own intelligence to the full.

It is a leap of faith to believe that just because humans intelligently design things, we or anything was intelligently designed.

prince wrote:You can recognize a computer is man-made, but can't recognize that a human is also made by something purposefully,
because you are not yet aware of what you are, and what you are not.

No prince. I reject the idea that we are "made by something purposeful" because I don't believe things without evidence. Even if we were intelligently created I wouldn't give a flying fuck. Whatever created us would ultimately be no more significant than road kill. Secondly, that wouldn't get us anywhere in figuring out what created the thing that created us. Lastly, you have no evidence to support your statements, thus I can reasonably assume you are not aware of what you are and have no confidence in your ability to decide on a purpose for yourself which causes you to believe a higher power has an imaginary purpose for you that may will magically be revealed at some point in the future, which conveniently makes you comfortable enough to believe these insane ideas of yours.

prince wrote:What you are not, is the field of awareness which creates the perimeter around what you are, that being which created you as a functioning aspect of itself, but in a subservient role.

What I am is what I define myself to be, and I define myself as my body and the consciousness it produces. Also, based on the SCIENTIFIC EVIDENCE my body is a product of causality, evolution, and my parents fucking, which caused a sperm cell and an ovum to combine and develop into an embryo which eventually turned into me. Have you ever even taken a science class?

prince wrote:Your role, your purpose is to act in an intelligent and inquisitive manner, to discover that which is self-evident, just as the superior intelligence does itself, by its very nature.

My purpose is whatever I decide it to be, which in turn is determined by causality. Your "superior intelligence" does not exist. Deal with it and move on.

prince wrote:God is essentially a computer, each human is a unique subroutine that manifests itself as a chemical apparatus. The reason being, God wishes to remain immortal, so does not transmute itself directly into the chemical realm (except on one occasion) but is able to infinitely manifest chemical designs by manipulating the density of energy fields.

I'm actually concerned that you might be hallucinating or are addicted to a substance that causes you to believe stupid bull shit. You should see a doctor just to make sure.

I can sum up your post as "wrong, wrong, wrong..."

You are the unhappy one shithead, not me.

Knock yourself out!

Grow up. Seriously.

You don't like the mirror do you?

What I posted is correct, it wasn't for reply.

What you posted is teleological nonsense.

Is it weally?

and what you post is not garbage, right?

It's perfectly solid and without question. That's why you are the perfectly sound and enlightened being that you are Dan.

Right? You know it all. And I know jack-shit, right?

As long as I agree with you, it's OK, right?

Nick Treklis wrote:

prince wrote: DNA is a set of instructions, a string of code. In turn, that code, when executed produces a human, an intelligent thing.

Wrong. DNA is not executed like a computer program.

It's not? how is it executed then, by sheer accident?

prince wrote: In turn, human created computers, modeled on the way the brain works (the created bears the fingerprints of the creator)

.

Nick Treklis wrote:Wrong. Humans do not fully understand how the brain functions, so even if they wanted to they couldn't design a computer completely based on it.

You, don't understand it. Don't speak for all, it makes you look like an ass.

prince wrote: The brain however, is significantly more capable and refined than any man-made computer.

Nick Treklis wrote: Wrong. Computers are far more powerful than the brain in many aspects. Computers solve complex math equations instantaneously, they've even better the best chess player in the world. Computers can potentially do everything better than humans at this point, aside from producing consciousness.

The human brain is designed for mainly emotional functions, not calculating. You are missing the point here.

prince wrote:(if you can bypass the delusion that one is a result of fortuitous events, which is ego-driven
and therefore intrinsically false),

Nick Treklis wrote:There is no evidence supporting the idea that evolution was a result of some intelligent force. To believe anything other than this is akin to believing in fairy tales.

When I said one, I meant "yourself" You don't know what fortuitous events means.

prince wrote:It's absolutely logical, to conclude that the DNA code, was in a like fashion modeled by an even greater intelligence. This is easily understood, if you utilize your own intelligence to the full.

Nick Treklis wrote: It is a leap of faith to believe that just because humans intelligently design things, we or anything was intelligently designed.

Well of course! we exercise intelligence by random endowment, and our intelligence is a result of chaos, right, dipshit? yeah that makes sense.

prince wrote:

Nick Treklis wrote:Wrong. DNA is not executed like a computer program.

It's not? how is it executed then, by sheer accident?

It never is "executed"! That would require an executer, and there is none!

prince wrote:

Nick Treklis wrote:Wrong. Humans do not fully understand how the brain functions, so even if they wanted to they couldn't design a computer completely based on it.

You, don't understand it. Don't speak for all, it makes you look like an ass.

Dude, I don't care how I "look". Secondly, it's a fact that nobody on this planet fully understands how the brain functions. And that includes you too princey.

prince wrote:

Nick Treklis wrote:Wrong. Computers are far more powerful than the brain in many aspects. Computers solve complex math equations instantaneously, they've even better the best chess player in the world. Computers can potentially do everything better than humans at this point, aside from producing consciousness.

The human brain is designed for mainly emotional functions, not calculating. You are missing the point here.

No I'm not. You just have no idea what the hell you are talking about. Everything you have said in this thread is complete non-sense.

prince wrote:

prince wrote:(if you can bypass the delusion that one is a result of fortuitous events, which is ego-driven
and therefore intrinsically false),

Nick Treklis wrote:There is no evidence supporting the idea that evolution was a result of some intelligent force. To believe anything other than this is akin to believing in fairy tales.

When I said one, I meant "yourself" You don't know what fortuitous events means.

What you call fortuitous events, I call evolution (a manifestation of causality). Whether we consider what happens to be fortuitous or not is completely based on our individual perspective, it does not speak to how things ultimately are. Your imaginary god is no exception regardless of the circumstances.

prince wrote:

Nick Treklis wrote:It is a leap of faith to believe that just because humans intelligently design things, we or anything was intelligently designed.

Well of course! we exercise intelligence by random endowment, and our intelligence is a result of chaos, right, dipshit? yeah that makes sense.

If by random and chaos you mean cause and effect which is determined, yet unknowable, and has no conscious or intelligent entity overseeing it, then yes that is correct. Why don't you get the courage to face your subconscious desire to block out reality and stop fantasizing that you're part of some magical purpose determined by an imaginary omnipotent creator who is going to rescue you through divine revelation? Stop being such a fucking pussy.

prince wrote:... God wishes to remain immortal, so does not transmute itself directly into the chemical realm (except on one occasion) but is able to infinitely manifest chemical designs by manipulating the density of energy fields.

Not one but on literary every occasion, your highness.

Don't tell me you're still getting drunk, on common Christianity and all the low brow stuff?

Nick Treklis wrote:Wrong. DNA is not executed like a computer program.

It's not? how is it executed then, by sheer accident?

It never is "executed"! That would require an executer, and there is none!

Right, it just happens at random, a person just occurs out of nothing, no reason, it just happens. The fact that a sperm and ovum starts this proccess is purely random and accidental, without any consequence...Sure, and pigs fly.

prince wrote:

prince wrote:(if you can bypass the delusion that one is a result of fortuitous events, which is ego-driven
and therefore intrinsically false),

Nick Treklis wrote:There is no evidence supporting the idea that evolution was a result of some intelligent force. To believe anything other than this is akin to believing in fairy tales.

When I said one, I meant "yourself" You don't know what fortuitous events means.

Nick Treklis wrote:What you call fortuitous events, I call evolution (a manifestation of causality). Whether we consider what happens to be fortuitous or not is completely based on our individual perspective, it does not speak to how things ultimately are. Your imaginary god is no exception regardless of the circumstances.

Ok, so in your view, you are a completely chance event, with no purpose, no inherent intelligence, except in a relative to your own experience sense, which makes you nothing at all because you are just bouncing of other chance events. You have no soul, is what you are saying, and I agree.

prince wrote:

Nick Treklis wrote:It is a leap of faith to believe that just because humans intelligently design things, we or anything was intelligently designed.

Well of course! we exercise intelligence by random endowment, and our intelligence is a result of chaos, right, dipshit? yeah that makes sense.

Nick Treklis wrote: If by random and chaos you mean cause and effect which is determined, yet unknowable, and has no conscious or intelligent entity overseeing it, then yes that is correct. Why don't you get the courage to face your subconscious desire to block out reality and stop fantasizing that you're part of some magical purpose determined by an imaginary omnipotent creator who is going to rescue you through divine revelation? Stop being such a fucking pussy.

It's not blocking out reality. You are doing that, by thinking you inherently exist outside of a reference point that frames your existence. That's what God is.

The question of being rescued is related to how well you can reconcile your spiritual-self with your chemical one. They exist in the same space, but are unaware of each other, until you awaken, then they become fused, locked into place.

When and if this happens, you will know.

If it doesn't, then you are completely fucked.

.. God wishes to remain immortal, so does not transmute itself directly into the chemical realm (except on one occasion) but is able to infinitely manifest chemical designs by manipulating the density of energy fields.

Diebert van Rhijn wrote:]Not one but on literary every occasion, your highness.

No, only one. For reasons which I don't know, it's only possible in the framework of the time and space of earth that there is a window where God can manifest itself into a chemical form every so often, every 2000 years it seems.

Don't tell me you're still getting drunk, on common Christianity and all the low brow stuff?

It's as high or low brow as your level of comprehension is.

prince wrote:For reasons which I don't know...

That would be called the lack of reason and equal to a statement of faith. Why do you not clearly speak out your beliefs and disregard for reasoning about the core tenets of your belief? It would make it so simpler to ignore it for everyone not interested in celebrating religious convictions with you.

Diebert van Rhijn wrote: That would be called the lack of reason and equal to a statement of faith. Why do you not clearly speak out your beliefs and disregard for reasoning about the core tenets of your belief? It would make it so simpler to ignore it for everyone not interested in celebrating religious convictions with you.

You're right, this is like David Quinn venturing his opinion, stated as fact, that definitely we dissipate like clouds when we die. It may be logical from one standpoint but it's unsupported by actual evidence and is certainly unprovable.