GENIUS FORUMS

Liberating oneself of psychological suffering is where moral reasoning/philosophy come into the picture, but what about physical pain? What is the primary difference between the two? Oscar Wilde once said, “Oh God, spare me the physical pain, and I will take care of the moral pain myself”

Why are there so many words to describe psychological suffering, but so very few to describe physical pain? The poets, mystics, and philosophers all seemed to dedicate most of their time to psychological suffering, but not as much time to physical pain.

I suspect this is the case because most occurrences of physical pain are very short-lived, and one forgets it after its over. However, sometimes these incidents are very prolonged, and during the time that physical pain exists, everything else is totally insignificant due to its magnitude. Physical pain is so tortuous in its immediacy that it seems to actually cripple our ability to function, and speak properly about it. All we can do is curse and think incoherently, as it seems to ignite primitive responses from within us.

When there is physical pain, that is all there is. And in a conscious person, perhaps the sensitivity to it is much more amplified. This is true because when an unconscious person is suffering from prolonged physical pain, they have the luxury of numbing it with various vices such as alcohol, marijuana, junk food, medication, pleasurable fantasies and all the rest of it.

However, the conscious individual usually doesn’t evade physical pain through these means, he simply suffers through it, as long as it takes. I can remember having migraine headaches that actually caused me to black out from the pain, but I find it interesting that descriptive words do not seem to exist to properly describe the subtlety of the suffering experienced.

Doctors use language to describe physical pain, but many times their language is very watered down to make the patients condition sound less troubling. One isn’t in total agony, he’s experiencing extreme discomfort, to use a doctor’s lingo. The latter is just a little more gentle, but it hides the reality is what is actually taking place.

Is physical pain so primordial that we simply block it out, refusing to properly acknowledge and describe it with the horrific subtlety that it deserves? At least with psychological suffering, one can reason one’s way out of it, but if one is lying on a hospital bed, and a cancerous tumor is eating away at ones organs from the inside out, then it is a fairly helpless and powerless position to be in. So perhaps because of the primordial nature of physical pain, and the fact that we are totally powerless against its severity as it occurs, we simply refuse to express it with the same subtlety as psychological pain…

Ryan R wrote: Why are there so many words to describe psychological suffering, but so very few to describe physical pain?

Well, I'm not even sure that's true.

Physical pain has numerous causes - - cavity, migraine, acid-reflux, stomach indigestion, infection, bruise, wound, burn, fractured bone, etc.

There are neutral words that describe both physical pain and psychological pain - - agony, misery, burning, anguish, pain, hurting, suffering, aching, torment, torture, etc.

However, there are words to describe phsyical pain that we would not normally use to describe psychological pain, for instance - heartburn, pounding head-ache, stomache-ache, toothache, athletes foot, ear-ache, rash, throbbing, spasm, etc.

Psychological pain has numerous causes - stealing, insulting or physically wounding someone, getting insulted, seeing yourself as inferior, thinking about the better choice you could have made rather than the crappy one you think you made, believing you are evil, stupid, believing you have caused other peple problems, believing people hate you, experiencing people not liking you as much as the other person, being alone when you desire not to be, etc.

Each of the causes of psyche pain I listed above can be described with the neutral words I listed above.

However, there are words to describe psychological pain that we would not normally use to describe phsyical pain.

Guilt, shame, sadness, worry, distress, grief, heartache, depression, anger, jealousy, sorrow, regret, despair, etc.

So that being said, I don't see that there are neccesarily more words to describe one compared to the other.

But Psychological pain is a bit more complex in that many of the types of psyche pain are very interconnected. For instance, guilt and sorrow, despite they are distinct and not just synonyms, often stem from the same event. Likewise, the reason a person feels despair might be, in part, the same reason he feels jealousy, shame, anger, hatred and heartache.

The poets, mystics, and philosophers all seemed to dedicate most of their time to psychological suffering, but not as much time to physical pain.

And likewise, there are many variously trained pain specialists, therapists and physiologists who focus almost completely on treating and empathizing with physical pain and hardly any time on psychological pain. With those types of profeesional you might even find that they speak metaphorical, dramatizing the pain a bit.

Those who focus more on psychological pain do so because they are more interested in the inner landscape, psychology, desire, how the mind works, etc. Such individuals are rare because it really makes you look at yourself, and some people have a hard time handling it.

Physical pain is so tortuous in its immediacy that it seems to actually cripple our ability to function, and speak properly about it.

I would say psychological pain does the same. Most people commit suicide because their psyche pain is too much to communicate - they havent the capacity to deal with it. I would say less people commit suicide over physical pain then they do over psyche pain.

All we can do is curse and think incoherently, as it seems to ignite primitive responses from within us.

What do you suppose the general response is from the man when his woman cheats on on him? I think you'll find some cursing and primitive responses just as readily as we see in the man who stubs his toe.

When there is physical pain, that is all there is.

If that's all there is, then one wouldnt be able to desire and apply some form of pain relief.

when an unconscious person is suffering from prolonged physical pain, they have the luxury of numbing it with various vices such as alcohol, marijuana, junk food, medication, pleasurable fantasies and all the rest of it.

People do the same thing in response to psychological pain. Reach for the remote, dig in the fridge, cupboards, roll a joint, get a beer, punch the wall, etc.

However, the conscious individual usually doesn’t evade physical pain through these means, he simply suffers through it, as long as it takes. I can remember having migraine headaches that actually caused me to black out from the pain, but I find it interesting that descriptive words do not seem to exist to properly describe the subtlety of the suffering experienced.

Sure they do - a pounding headache, torment, a sledgehammer to the skull, hell, agony, etc. I'm sure there are plenty of people who really get descriptive.

Doctors use language to describe physical pain, but many times their language is very watered down to make the patients condition sound less troubling.

If a man goes to the psychologist, I don't think you'll find the doctor reaching for any big metaphors of similies either.

One isn’t in total agony, he’s experiencing extreme discomfort, to use a doctor’s lingo. The latter is just a little more gentle, but it hides the reality is what is actually taking place.

Its true that he may be doing this to downplay it - - but it depends on the doctor, and proffessionals in general tend to refrain from dramatizing things. As I said earlier, a psychologist generally is not going to use phrases like 'total agony' either. Professinals are trained to be clincial, unemotional and technical - not artistic in their descriptions.

Is physical pain so primordial that we simply block it out, refusing to properly acknowledge and describe it with the horrific subtlety that it deserves?

Some people just don't have the vocabularly nor the desire to communicate their pain to others to such a degree. Doctors may not use words like 'agony, misery, torture' - - but the patients who experience such physical pain often do.

But your right - some people suffer physically more than others. But then again, some suffer psychologially more than others without any means to relief.

At least with psychological suffering, one can reason one’s way out of it

Some people can't - - no amount of medication works for them, and philosophically they just dont have the intellect and character. It's bad luck.

but if one is lying on a hospital bed, and a cancerous tumor is eating away at ones organs from the inside out, then it is a fairly helpless and powerless position to be in.

In an unfree, irrational society, yes it is - - but in the more rational parts of the world, Euthanasia is legal. There is no need to suffer to that degree.

As for your migraines - - that's bad luck in the same way that a person with an untreatably severe form of schitzophrenia has bad luck. That's assuming your migraines are untreatable.

So perhaps because of the primordial nature of physical pain, and the fact that we are totally powerless against its severity as it occurs, we simply refuse to express it with the same subtlety as psychological pain…

Actually, in public life it's far more acceptable to make it known to others that you are experiencing a bad head ache, migraine, broken leg, twisted ankle, etc. Psychological suffering is very taboo. You don't hear of many people calling in to work sick saying: I'm not coming to work today because I'm devestated to discover my girlfriend has left me for someone else, or I can't make it in today because I'm suffering from halluciations, light headedness and severe depression, or because I can't stop washing my hands and I'm afraid I'll have a panic attack on the bus or while working.

Philosophers historically likewise have been very loathe to talk about psychological suffering. Buddha was quite rare, and Schopenhauer, Kierkegaard and Nietzche, were quite novel in that they were the first westerners to talk about it. Before them, philosophy was largely an indulgent abuse of words, an indulgence in complexity and empty abstractions - an escape. Plato is a good example of this, whereas the concerns of the stoics, Heraclitus, Democritus, Socrates and greek poets hint that they focused quite a bit on psycholgoical suffering - they are largely the pioneers of psychology.

It's also interesting to note that a great deal of physical suffering is the result of violent actions by individuals who were violent largely because they were ignorant of their own psychology.

If the mind and its suffering is understood, then we can deal with eliminating physical pain much more effectively.

Cory,

People do the same thing in response to psychological pain. Reach for the remote, dig in the fridge, cupboards, roll a joint, get a beer, punch the wall, etc.

Yes, I realize these similarities between psychological and physical pain, but I failed to properly express it.

Sure they do - a pounding headache, torment, a sledgehammer to the skull, hell, agony, etc. I'm sure there are plenty of people who really get descriptive.

I would say not many. The doctors have the words, but most of the patients do not have as many descriptive words for it. However, one could say the same with psychological suffering. Generally, humans do not have many words to describe things period. For instance: my family members are able to survive with a limited lexicon compared to a scientist, specialist, or philosopher.

Actually, in public life it's far more acceptable to make it known to others that you are experiencing a bad head ache, migraine, broken leg, twisted ankle, etc. Psychological suffering is very taboo. You don't hear of many people calling in to work sick saying: I'm not coming to work today because I'm devastated to discover my girlfriend has left me for someone else, or I can't make it in today because I'm suffering from halluciations, light headedness and severe depression, or because I can't stop washing my hands and I'm afraid I'll have a panic attack on the bus or while working.

Yes, quite. This is probably true because there is a fear of the speaker to reveal their inferiority, and there is awkwardness from the boss to have to respond correctly, so people tend to avoid psychological pain. Physical pain involves less judgment of personal character, and that is why it is generally more acceptable to speak about.

If the mind and its suffering is understood, then we can deal with eliminating physical pain much more effectively.

Yes, there is an obvious causal condition between some forms of psychological suffering and some forms of physical suffering.

Ryan R wrote:Why are there so many words to describe psychological suffering, but so very few to describe physical pain?

Every one knows what pain feels like. Describing it is like trying to describe what red looks like.

DHodges wrote: Every one knows what pain feels like. Describing it is like trying to describe what red looks like.

True, but the pain from breaking my arm is significantly different than the pain from a migraine which is significantly different than even a sinus headache...

Katy wrote:

True, but the pain from breaking my arm is significantly different than the pain from a migraine which is significantly different than even a sinus headache...

Exactly, that is my point. And we dont have the language to fully capture the essence of each type of pain.

We say something like "oh it was agony when I broke my arm, or it was agony when I had that sinus headache, or it was hell when I had that migraine. However, to use one noun to describe prolongued suffering is an insult to human intelligence. For instance: A serious migraine headache has many different types of physical pain associated with it, there is a unique pain in the temples, the face, the back of the skull, the eyelids, inside the brain itself, if one looks at light, or hears loud sounds, there is a totally different type of pain, it causes muscle spasms, and one cannot stop shaking. and all one is left to do is moan pathetically like an animal.

Each type of physical pain has a uniqueness that is usually never described as such, except technically in a broad context by the medical profession, which is usually a rather cold and deattached method anyhow.

I agree with Cory when he states that people generally fail to acknowledge the complexity of psychological suffering, but one could also make the same argument for physical suffering as well.

Ryan R wrote: For instance: A serious migraine headache has many different types of physical pain associated with it, there is a unique pain in the temples, the face, the back of the skull, the eyelids, inside the brain itself, if one looks at light, or hears loud sounds, there is a totally different type of pain, it causes muscle spasms, and one cannot stop shaking. and all one is left to do is moan pathetically like an animal.

Each type of physical pain has a uniqueness that is usually never described as such, except technically in a broad context by the medical profession, which is usually a rather cold and deattached method anyhow.

Wow, you seem to be quite the connoisseur.