The Lethargic working class

[Ryan Rudolph]

Recently, I took a part-time job doing labor work in the construction industry, and I noticed something quite significant in terms of the changes that happened to the body. First of all, the body of a working laborer gets through the day by increased levels of adrenline being produced, as the amount of labor that is expected is totally unreasonable. Supervisors expect the workers to perform at a superhuman capacity, which illustrates that they have absolutely no sensitivity for the suffering of others. Anyway, the adrendine overrides the pain of the sore muscles and keeps the body going. However, after a working laborer gets home, and slows down, the body literally shuts down, and sleep is almost immediate. I was quite surprised in how uncontrollable the total shutdown of the body is, and I suspect that this one of the factors to explain why the working class are so lethargic in the evenings.

The evenings used to be the time when I was at my peak levels of consciousness, but now I can barely browse on Genius Forum without fighting off sleep urges…

I’ll have to quit this job soon I guess, and allow the body to regenerate, and get back to its regular cycles.

[ChochemV2]

I remember a summer job I had a while ago where I spent all day doing things like tarring the factory roof, cutting back the plants around the area, cleaning up trash, painting, etc. I had a similar experience where I'd get home and just pass out after a day of work. There were some good things, however, the work would clear out the clutter my mind was at that time and allow me to think more clearly though that is probably only because I was almost completely unsupervised and was never really yelled at to move faster, work harder, etc, so my mind could work. Also, it brought me back to the forums which lead to picking up philosophy again (which I had stepped back from for two years) and I'm extremely glad for that.

[Carl G]

Ryan,

I, too, have worked construction and know of what you speak. You didn't say where the adrenalin (go-power) comes in; partially fear of being fired, and also fueled by coffee, tobacco, and soft drinks. Sometimes beer. Adrenalin or no, the body crashes after a hard day of over-straining. The construction industry, farming, and others I'm sure, are run on the willingness of workers to abuse their bodies. It is required by most management. Sheet-rockers die off first, then framers, roofers, insulators and painters. Electricians and plumbers last a little while longer. Few survive on the front lines after age forty.

[Katy]

Summer camp councelor had the same effect on me. It wasn't strenuous physically but involved a lot of stress/adrenaline keeping track of 20 7 year olds. I got an hour break every day and I just slept. It was sad.

But also, I think a lot of it was that I was always in the sun. I've found, since moving here, that a day in the sun/at the beach can sap my energy even if I'm just sitting around... not to exhaustion but to sitting at home going "dont wanna read... or look at internet... or cook..." (though obviously no sun is bad too) (though I guess swimming is actually more work than it looks like... but still not comparable to labor)

Anyone ever had a warehouse job? Where the work load was similar but without the sun?

[ChochemV2]

I used to work in a computer parts warehouse where I'd be running around all day stocking parts and packing orders. At first it was pretty bad where I'd get home and my feet would be killing me and I could barely function but it was easier to get used to than roofing and landscaping. I only lasted a couple months, though, so I can't speak to the long term effects but after a few weeks you fell into a rhythm and the day wasn't very difficult. I actually looked forward to getting home, taking a shower, and reading after that day.

[Tomas]

-Rest Home Ryan writes-

Recently, I took a part-time job doing labor work in the construction industry, and I noticed something quite significant in terms of the changes that happened to the body. First of all, the body of a working laborer gets through the day by increased levels of adrenline being produced, as the amount of labor that is expected is totally unreasonable.


-tomas-
Change your diet.



-Rest Home Ryan-
Supervisors expect the workers to perform at a superhuman capacity, which illustrates that they have absolutely no sensitivity for the suffering of others.



-tomas-
No, they (the good ones anyway) have gone through the 'learning process' and have to pick up the slack when the tired-asses can't cut it. Depending upon where you live, the construction "season" is factored by the weather climes (winter, rainy season etc).


-Rest Home Ryan-
Anyway, the adrendine overrides the pain of the sore muscles and keeps the body going. However, after a working laborer gets home, and slows down, the body literally shuts down, and sleep is almost immediate.


-tomas-
Well, duhhh.




-Rest Home Ryan-
I was quite surprised in how uncontrollable the total shutdown of the body is, and I suspect that this one of the factors to explain why the working class are so lethargic in the evenings.



-tomas-
Your version of "working class" will never get a pay raise nor promotion to supervisor.



-Rest Home Ryan-
The evenings used to be the time when I was at my peak levels of consciousness, but now I can barely browse on Genius Forum without fighting off sleep urges…



-tomas-
Peak levels of consciousness begin when waking up (depending upon work shift time of day.)



-Rest Home Ryan-
I'll have to quit this job soon I guess, and allow the body to regenerate, and get back to its regular cycles.

-tomas-
Waking up at 2 in the afternoon?

Sleep your life away! Slacker.


Tomas (the tank)
VietNam veteran - 1971

.

[Tomas]

-Choke Em All writes-

I remember a summer job I had a while ago where I spent all day doing things like tarring the factory roof, cutting back the plants around the area, cleaning up trash, painting, etc.


-tomas-
A job 'a while ago'?

Do you work at all in any other season to supplement your lifestyle?



-Choke Em All-
I had a similar experience where I'd get home and just pass out after a day of work.



-tomas-
Change your diet.



-Choke Em All-
There were some good things, however, the work would clear out the clutter my mind was at that time and allow me to think more clearly though that is probably only because I was almost completely unsupervised and was never really yelled at to move faster, work harder, etc, so my mind could work.


-tomas-
Decent, hardworking supervisors needn't "yell" (browbeat whatever) to make their case. Do the job at hand and all is well.



-Choke Em All-
Also, it brought me back to the forums



-tomas-
Dan, Kevin, and David smile :-)



-Choke Em All-
which lead to picking up philosophy again (which I had stepped back from for two years) and I'm extremely glad for that.

-tomas-
You better run along now...



Tomas (the tank)
VietNam veteran - 1971


.

[Tomas]

-Soft Touch writes-

Ryan, I, too, have worked construction and know of what you speak.



-tomas-
With nary a blister, no doubt!



-Soft Touch-
You didn't say where the adrenalin (go-power) comes in; partially fear of being fired,



-tomas-
A day in the life of...




-Soft Touch-
and also fueled by coffee, tobacco, and soft drinks.



-tomas-
God Bless America!! (where's the national anthem when you need it?) Heheheh




-Soft Touch-
Sometimes beer.



-tomas-
Drink responsibly!



-Soft Touch-
Adrenalin or no, the body crashes after a hard day of over-straining.



-tomas-
Pace yourself!




-Soft Touch-
The construction industry, farming, and others I'm sure, are run on the willingness of workers to abuse their bodies.



-tomas-
Good god, what is this world coming to?



-Soft Touch-
It is required by most management.



-tomas-
Bullshit!



-Soft Touch
Sheet-rockers die off first, then framers, roofers, insulators and painters.



-tomas-
Roofers have a short lifespan. However, modern techniques (mexican laborers) are changing the landscape. :-)



-Soft Touch-
Electricians and plumbers last a little while longer.



-tomas-
The 'good ones' make the money and get out to start their own little niche business.



-Soft Touch-
Few survive on the front lines after age forty.

-tomas-
Somewhat true, take it easy on the booze, coffee, cigs, poor dietary choices. True Genius is in to saving the money and investing it wisely.

That said, growing up in (post)-industrial First World America is still better than some parts of "modern" China and other U.S. Dollar-fueled smokestack economies.

Simplistic answers but better than what some of you have answered with no idea of recognizing what a seed potato looks like, much less a mustard seed, carrot seed or a Black Angus.

You greenhorns... better you stay eating out of a can or french fry paper sack. Don't tread around my farm back in Dakota looking for a handout :-(


ps - happy times are about over in Amerikkka



Tomas (the tank)
VietNam veteran - 1971



.

[ChochemV2]

Do you work at all in any other season to supplement your lifestyle?

I was in high school and chose to only work a summer job.

Decent, hardworking supervisors needn't "yell" (browbeat whatever) to make their case. Do the job at hand and all is well.

Decent, logical posters realize this isn't a negation of the point they are responding to.

Dan, Kevin, and David smile :-)

Well, that was about three years ago and I've only come here in the past month or two so...they need not smile very wide since this wasn't my first stop.

You better run along now...

Take your pills, the doctors give them to you for a reason.

[Tomas]

-tomas-
Suffice to say no wonder Western civilization continues to decline... The below.


Tomas (the the tank)
VietNam veteran - 1971



........

Summer camp councelor had the same effect on me. It wasn't strenuous physically but involved a lot of stress/adrenaline keeping track of 20 7 year olds. I got an hour break every day and I just slept. It was sad.

But also, I think a lot of it was that I was always in the sun. I've found, since moving here, that a day in the sun/at the beach can sap my energy even if I'm just sitting around... not to exhaustion but to sitting at home going "dont wanna read... or look at internet... or cook..." (though obviously no sun is bad too) (though I guess swimming is actually more work than it looks like... but still not comparable to labor)

Anyone ever had a warehouse job? Where the work load was similar but without the sun?

[Tomas]

-Soap Opera-

I used to work in a computer parts warehouse where I'd be running around all day stocking parts and packing orders.


-tomas-
The devil would come to me?



-More Loser-
At first it was pretty bad where I'd get home and my feet would be killing me


-tomas-
Punk.



-Prescription boy-
and I could barely function but it was easier to get used to than roofing and landscaping.


-tomas-
Your Mama



-The Loser-
I only lasted a couple months, though, so I can't speak to the long term effects but after a few weeks you fell into a rhythm and the day wasn't very difficult.


-tomas-
Get a life



-Sluggo-
I actually looked forward to getting home, taking a shower, and reading after that day.

-tomas-
Where were you when the end is near?



Tomas (the tank)
VietNam veteran - 1971


.

[brokenhead]

It always bothers me when I hear people look at a group of guys working a construction site and comment how they all just seem to be standing around. You can be pretty sure such observers have not done manual labor to any degree. I worked in a bakery factory for a year or two in college where between stacking scores of 50 lb. flour sacks and moving huge doughs from one machine to another then out to trucks, I was lifting over three tons a day, and that was part-time. When those construction workers are laboring, they are laboring. There's no way a guy, especially past his twenties, can keep up peak pace for eight hours every day. Any good supervisor knows that - if he doesn't, he won't last long.

[Ryan Rudolph]

brokenhead wrote:

It always bothers me when I hear people look at a group of guys working a construction site and comment how they all just seem to be standing around. You can be pretty sure such observers have not done manual labor to any degree. I worked in a bakery factory for a year or two in college where between stacking scores of 50 lb. flour sacks and moving huge doughs from one machine to another then out to trucks, I was lifting over three tons a day, and that was part-time. When those construction workers are laboring, they are laboring. There's no way a guy, especially past his twenties, can keep up peak pace for eight hours every day. Any good supervisor knows that - if he doesn't, he won't last long.

Yes, those are typical statements from people that lack imagination. They might have very well worked labor jobs themselves, but they easily forget what sort of misery that had to endure. People judge solely based on external appearances, with absolutely no understanding of the subjective motivation of why a construction worker is using his shovel to hold himself up. First of all, it is bloody hot standing out on a freeway all day long, and one loses energy very quickly. Second, the body exerts a lot of energy just trying to stay standing, and that’s not including the energy exerted from doing the actual labor work itself. All and all, it is a hellish job, and its tragic and unfortunate how much suffering much be endured just to keep civilization running.

An ignorant statement that makes me cringe everytime is when I hear people say “Oh, look at those construction workers standing around, can you believe that thats where all our tax dollars are going?”

Such a statement is the epitome of bourgeois ignorance; it illustrates a complete lack of perception, emotional senstivity, judgment, imagination, character, and so on. It is so smug, self-satisfied, and entirely self-concerned that one loses all hope for the neurological nightmare that is humanity.

[ChochemV2]

Hell, I have some minimum amount of knowledge about how difficult their jobs is and I still crack jokes because, you know, sometimes things are just funny.

[Diebert van Rhijn]

Tomas is chatty these days: keep up the good work!

On the topic: I've passed out after long days at air-conditioned offices, humming machines, all the office mind gamez. Slept from 7PM to 6AM on the couch.

But my days working at construction sites: high up, climbing on and off scaffolding and ladders, carrying bricks, steel, glass, sand around... those were the days... body was tired but I felt good end of the day. The mind calm and rested and could engage in many mental activities for hours with enough energy.

Diet is important too, different food intake could be needed to deal with muscle stress.

My guess would be that if you're somewhere that gives you tension on a psychological level, it will severally limit the psychical endurance - like a non-stop cramp. IF you can relax, laugh with the guys, distribute your efforts, enjoy the air, the shouts, the passer-by, the views from high-up, the slowly rise of a building... that can give you enough to feel comfortable where you are. Different story unfolds.

Not saying that it's somehow a switch you can flick: if the place or the people have such impact on you psychically then it's not the place to be. Grow a thicker skin, tougher skeleton or choose a better suited environment.

[Ryan Rudolph]

ChochemV2 wrote:

Hell, I have some minimum amount of knowledge about how difficult their jobs is and I still crack jokes because, you know, sometimes things are just funny.

I hate to be the party crasher here, but…

What you are referring to is a knee-jerk reaction.

Moreover, if you take the matter lightly, it is indication that you don’t fully understand the extent of how brutal, tragic, and painful such an existence is, because if you truly understood, you’d be so humbled by imagining the subjective predicament of others, that there’d be no laughter at all, perhaps just a light sadness or intense seriousness for the plight of humanity.

One can either sadistically laugh at the pain of others or one can feel tremendous seriousness for the pain of others. The latter is less desirable, but it is the most honest response.

We are conditioned to believe that a construction worker holding himself up on a shovel is a symbol of weakness, laziness, inefficiency, and so on, but that superficial judgment is assuming there is nothing inherently wrong, tragic, and immoral, with our present work conditions. Such a view is the legacy of a baby boomer generation that prides itself on toil and misery. The baby boomer work ethic view entails of the belief that suffering should be endured for the sake of sustaining the family unit, whereas a wise person believes that suffering should be prevented for the sake of sustaining ones sanity and wellbeing.

My latest quote:

Life is a collection of experiences, survival tasks, duties and obligations that are involuntarily imposed on us that ‘god consciousness’ has absolutely no desire to participate in whatsoever.

[Ryan Rudolph]

Diebert wrote:

Grow a thicker skin, tougher skeleton or choose a better suited environment.

This body isn’t incapable of adapting to such harsh environments; I’m far too sensitive. And as Carl stated earlier, many people can adapt for a certain period of time, but eventually their bodies’ give out on them as well.

I’ll share my latest male bonding experience with you Diebert -

Actually, it is quite ironic because the other day my superior labeled me as feminine, but his conception of femininity is very different to how femininity is typically defined on this forum.

My boss took me into a trailer, and there were a few windows weighing about three hundred pounds each, and he wanted me to grab one end, and help him carry them up a flight of stairs.

I said “you’re gotta be kidding me, that’s suicide, I’m not doing that, its totally insane.

He said, “oh come on, don’t be a woman, its all mental, if you believe you can, then you can”

I said, “no, the body has limitations, why do you think that your lower back is messed up, and you need to take extra strength pain killers every night, the power of belief is total baloney”

He stopped arguing with me, and found someone else. However, now he calls me ‘Princess’ because of my tendency to pick and choose what jobs I’ll participate in while I’m working.

So that is my experience of laughing with the guys…

So his conception of masculinity is based on physical strength - the ability to lift heavy things – a very shallow, animalistic and primal conception.

[Elizabeth Isabelle]

Your continual use of the word tragic just sounds a bit melodramatic. Brutal, yes, but tragic? Yes, it's physically demanding enough that only males and the females who look like they abuse steroids physically can do it, and any job that requires more physical effort than the last job is going to take some getting used to (yes, even just standing at a cash register for 8 or 12 hours is going to hurt like mad the first few weeks), but people get used to it. I remember working at a book store where one of the requirements was the ability to lift a 25 pound box. No big deal, right? My second day on the job, I was required to unload a semi filled with books. I forget how many tons the driver said it was, but the girl working with me was on light duty and couldn't lift anything, and the driver said it wasn't in his contract to help unload. I got half the semi unloaded and finally asked the other girl to call the supervisor - who came in and helped but reamed me out because I'd said I'd be able to lift 25 pound boxes. There's a difference between one, or a few, 25 pound boxes and single-handedly moving a few tons of books. After building up some muscle I probably would have been able to do it, but the second day on the job is unrealistic, and getting reamed and called a liar when all I was asked was if I could lift "a box about that size" and not automatically translating that to however many tons of books can fit in a semi was both painful and representative of how most managers of minimum wage workers behave, but I wouldn't go so far as to call it tragic.

People getting limbs blown off in a war caused by a lack of wisdom is tragic. Birth defects and various diseases because companies bribe their way into being allowed to sell toxic goods (cigarettes are legal but Vegemite is not?) or unethically get around hazardous waste disposal methods, are tragic. Shots that our soldiers were required to take that caused Gulf War Syndrome in a percentage of the guys that got immunized was tragic, and that their symptoms were denied and their illness not covered was tragic. Digging ditches for a living is not tragic. It just isn't for everyone. Some even enjoy that they get paid for doing "good exercise" (quoted because I've heard at least one guy refer to it as such).

[Tomas]

.


(some humor - some serious)

-bread board pines-

It always bothers me when I hear people look at a group of guys working a construction site and comment how they all just seem to be standing around.


-tomas-
Surely! Very tough work, indeed. OSHA laws to follow, building codes, blueprints must be followed "exactly", power lines filled with electricity, blad-de-blah etc.
The pay is premium, as it should be.


-bread board surmises-
You can be pretty sure such observers have not done manual labor to any degree.


-tomas-
This is unknown.


-bread head recalls-
I worked in a bakery factory for a year or two in college where between stacking scores of 50 lb. flour sacks and moving huge doughs from one machine to another then out to trucks, I was lifting over three tons a day, and that was part-time.


-tomas-
Macho man!


-bread board ogles-
When those construction workers are laboring, they are laboring.


-tomas-
Y-M-C-A...


-bread board squints-
There's no way a guy, especially past his twenties, can keep up peak pace for eight hours every day.


-tomas-
For most, about age 35-40. At least it follows baseball, basketball, soccer, when the knees and/or elbows go, they're history.

Save the money, invest wisely, build for the duffer-days. Be straight-up in all you're dealings. Marry well, raise the children as you would have wanted to be. It'll come back to you in due time.


-bread board admonishes-
Any good supervisor knows that - if he doesn't, he won't last long.

-tomas-
A good boss strives for genius.



Tomas (the tank)
VietNam veteran - 1971


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[ChochemV2]

Moreover, if you take the matter lightly, it is indication that you don’t fully understand the extent of how brutal, tragic, and painful such an existence is, because if you truly understood, you’d be so humbled by imagining the subjective predicament of others, that there’d be no laughter at all, perhaps just a light sadness or intense seriousness for the plight of humanity.

If I were to spend all my time feeling sad and depressed at what I witness every single day I wouldn't have the energy to do anything.

There is no reason for me to tie the state of my own mental facilities so tightly to the plights of others because it accomplishes nothing. It enhances neither my own life nor the person who I am feeling sorry for.

Pity is the most useless emotion one can succumb to.

It's always fun to see someone try so hard to paint me as an evil person in lieu of any kind of real argument but it does become old after a while.

[Elizabeth Isabelle]

I can't imagine the he-man types that usually go for the heavy labor jobs even wanting the pity either.

[Ryan Rudolph]

Elizabeth wrote:

Your continual use of the word tragic just sounds a bit melodramatic. Brutal, yes, but tragic? Yes, it's physically demanding enough that only males and the females who look like they abuse steroids physically can do it

It depends on how sensitive, and aware you are. Laborers adapt, but their adaptation is not without enduring endless suffering related to injury, weather conditions, stress on the body, frustration, and so on.

An ignorant man working in civilization (especially in the construction industry) is always tragic. My boss has many physical problems caused by injuries on site, he has digestive problems caused by his fast food diet, and his frivolous money habits keep his enslaved to his hellish occupation.

His entire life is tragic.

Humanity and tragedy always travel together. There is an element of tragedy in each life, no matter what degree of wisdom there is. Life is suffering, endless desire, toil, misery, emotional confusion, and all the rest of it.

We are involunarily born into a harsh environment with a crude, confused animal brain, and are thrown into the world and forced to survive. That sounds like the makings of a good tragedy to me...


ChochemV2 wrote:

There is no reason for me to tie the state of my own mental facilities so tightly to the plights of others because it accomplishes nothing.

So instead you just laugh at them, many times laughter is an unconscious reaction to a serious predicament. We are conditioned to be sadistic, but perhaps it is something to go beyond…

There is pity, and then there is actually feeling what others are feeling in the same moment due to such subtle subjective intimacy you have with them.

I don’t advocate pity, but compassion is having the emotional knowledge of what others are experiencing, and sometimes, on rare instances, one actually experiences the same emotional states as the other as it happens.

[ChochemV2]

I don’t advocate pity, but compassion is having the emotional knowledge of what others are experiencing, and sometimes, on rare instances, one actually experiences the same emotional states as the other as it happens.

Compassion is not something I reserve for construction workers. They have chosen their direction in life, they get paid for it, and they could always quit and do something else. We all make choices which determine how our lives turn out and I'm not going to feel compassion for someone about something they consciously chose to do. Whether it was through delusions from social programming, a lack of drive to study hard and work on something else, or because they wanted to do something physically demanding these people aren't held as slaves and they get paid a good wage for what they do so I'm not going to feel their aches and pains because I'd hate to do their job.

[Carl G]

They have chosen their direction in life...they could always quit and do something else. We all make choices which determine how our lives turn out...something they consciously chose to do

You grant the average person freewill, and hold him to it, when he has none. This comes across as callous, and incredibly naive.

they get paid for it...these people aren't held as slaves and they get paid a good wage...

Ever heard the expression "wage slaves"? It's the hand-to-mouth existence that has plagued the undereducated and over-procreative since before the industrial revolution.

Anyway, lots of construction laborers do not get paid well for what they do.

Compassion is not something I reserve for construction workers...I'm not going to feel their aches and pains...

Fine. If you don't want to feel their pain, don't. But no need to justify it with your textbook rhetoric.

[Elizabeth Isabelle]

Humanity and tragedy always travel together. There is an element of tragedy in each life, no matter what degree of wisdom there is. Life is suffering, endless desire, toil, misery, emotional confusion, and all the rest of it.

Well, that's kind of what I meant by melodramatic. I can almost picture someone putting her wrist to her forehead and declaring with a wimper "Uh! The tragedy of it all!" Yes, all of life has a common thread of tragedy, ugliness, etc. - so why single out construction workers? You could just as easily lament the tragedy of rock stars or computer programmers.