September 11, 2001

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hsandman
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Re:

Post by hsandman »

Dan Rowden wrote:
Tharan wrote:Where's Dan?
I'm over there in the corner, loading the ammo....
Use gloves... ;-)
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daybrown
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Re: September 11, 2001

Post by daybrown »

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... 3615&hl=en
is the most convincing and lucid explanation of what happened to the twin towers yet.
If there was a pancake collapse, very well, the floors slide down like a stack of washers sliding down a bolt. But that dont bring down the bolt. And at the beginning of his presentation, he shows us a photo taken from across the river where you can see the central cluster of columns around the elevator shafts... are still standing after the floors collapsed.

Why did the core come down? Mr. Ross shows us that explosives were placed in the elevator shafts where the people in the building would not have known anything was going on. This means that a small crew could have done it over a series of months. We dont need any grand conspiracy of hundreds.

The next question is when this presentation, which blows the official 911 report to kingdom come, and proves beyond any reasonable doubt that there was a kind of controlled demolition... when this information will spread among enuf surfers to reach the consciousness of the rest of the electorate even without the corporate media saying anything about it.

For years I have seen the postings suggest that those who doubted the official report were irrational, but now I see the shift to where its only the defenders of the official 911 report that are seen as delusional. Before the presidential primary season is over, I can see some candidate, loosing support, take up the 911 truth issue as a desperate measure. It mite work.
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Alex Jacob
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Re: September 11, 2001

Post by Alex Jacob »

Alex Jones spells it out

Hear, oh Israel, the Message of David Shayler!
_____________________________________________________

Strange how things are evolving, ain't it?
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Re: September 11, 2001

Post by daybrown »

Alex Jacob wrote:Alex Jones spells it out

Hear, oh Israel, the Message of David Shayler!
_____________________________________________________

Strange how things are evolving, ain't it?
I dunno; seems like they've always been strange. I dunno whether the emotionality of Youtube will wake sheeple up, or whether it'll take ongoing worsening financial crisis. You know there's really important stuff going on; the playoffs are coming, and then there's the Superbowl. And by then the NBA race will be heating up, and the next thing you know, its opening day in Baseball.

Has the writer's strike affected the soap operas? I mean if they are not careful, and dont get the writers back at work telling sheeple what to think, sheeple mite start doing that all by themselves. Who knows what they will then think?
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Alex Jacob
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Re: September 11, 2001

Post by Alex Jacob »

Don't get me wrong, I don't at all mean to ridicule anyone's concern about these events. And it may turn out that something happens in the minds and spirits of people generally (the 'sheeple' as you say) and they 'wake up'. I also completely understand and agree with your concerns, expressed in other threads, for the rise of a kind of fascism. The reason I posted that cartoon-like diatribe by Alex Jones was for a few different reasons. On another forum I came across a critique of Alex Jones as inciting only a sort of paranoia in his listeners and viewers. It's all gloom and doom with Alex Jones, and his 'message' (if there is one) will likely keep people more mystified about the structure of power and the way 'power systems' function than actually educate them, or direct them to take some sort of rational political action. Alex Jones' whole message is flagrantly emotional and borders into a kind of paranoid mysticism. He is selling a message, a show, a theatre, and earns his living from it. Wise not to forget that.

The other guy, who I had never heard of, I came across following back the vid you posted to the site it is housed on, and I simply find it interesting how the mysticism is now out in the open, and how this mystical-romantic politicalism begins to take the shape of and tends toward a mysticism of the Second Coming.

So, here's another odd bit, at least for me, but it is pretty personal. Years ago, I think it was in 84, way before the advent of the internet and digital teevee, I had one of those very powerful dreams that mark epochs in a person's life. It was an 'end of the world' dream, which psychologically is a special category, and without going into the details of it, one of the final scenes was where I was in an underground shelter after the first stages in a series of cataclysmic world-level explosions. Someone had set up this underground shelter with provisions and emergency equipment. They turned on the teevee and there was some guy, some anchorman, reciting some calming, general information about what was happening, and yet it seemed false or incomplete. When I stepped forward and looked closer at the teevee I was shocked to discover that instead of a filmed image in a studio (i.e. 'real'), it was really an extremely well-produced cartoon of an anchorman delivering the news. The weird thing is that this was years before teevee went digital and it was only years after that dream that all teevee productions, and especially news programs, began to take on that look, such for example we all saw during the First Gulf War (which of course was written about extensively by media studies people).

Let us suppose that I agree with you that 'people need to wake up'. But as they 'wake up' they rise up through all sorts of different levels of dream, and their perception is still dreamy, still mystified, and they still react to events like they have been trained to react by teevee and by movies: awed paranoia and powerlessness. The thing is that no one seems to know, definitively, what 'waking up' is or what the awake are then supposed to do. And also, those who suppose they are 'awake', what if they are just in another level of dream, daybrown? What if you and me and others are, in fact, presenting stories that are not much more than different levels of dream?

That is why I have the feeling that we cannot disregard the psychological dimension in 'all this'. It is now very, very strange what 'people' seem to 'think', and it will likely get stranger. And if some potent movement arises to capture their perceptions, or some messenger who embodies an old, potent archetype, now submerged and dormant, and pulls us and them into a sort of messianism or heaven knows what? Well, the ride will only get stranger. You say that 'people need to wake up' but what if it turns out they need to be kept dreaming, but dreaming better dreams?
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hsandman
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Re: September 11, 2001

Post by hsandman »

Alex, have you seen a movie called "S1mone"?
As Al puts it in the movie: " Our capacity to manufacture bullshit, has exceeded our capacity to detect it."

I recomend you watch it, while the movie has no (imo)artistic merit, it might be of interest to you. ;-)

Edit: ps. Alex, Ahoy Sailor! Listen to this song. :^)
Last edited by hsandman on Sun Dec 23, 2007 9:08 am, edited 2 times in total.
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daybrown
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Re: September 11, 2001

Post by daybrown »

Alex Jacob wrote:Don't get me wrong, I don't at all mean to ridicule anyone's concern about these events. And it may turn out that something happens in the minds and spirits of people generally (the 'sheeple' as you say) and they 'wake up'. I also completely understand and agree with your concerns, expressed in other threads, for the rise of a kind of fascism. The reason I posted that cartoon-like diatribe by Alex Jones was for a few different reasons. On another forum I came across a critique of Alex Jones as inciting only a sort of paranoia in his listeners and viewers. It's all gloom and doom with Alex Jones, and his 'message' (if there is one) will likely keep people more mystified about the structure of power and the way 'power systems' function than actually educate them, or direct them to take some sort of rational political action. Alex Jones' whole message is flagrantly emotional and borders into a kind of paranoid mysticism. He is selling a message, a show, a theatre, and earns his living from it. Wise not to forget that.

The other guy, who I had never heard of, I came across following back the vid you posted to the site it is housed on, and I simply find it interesting how the mysticism is now out in the open, and how this mystical-romantic politicalism begins to take the shape of and tends toward a mysticism of the Second Coming.

So, here's another odd bit, at least for me, but it is pretty personal. Years ago, I think it was in 84, way before the advent of the internet and digital teevee, I had one of those very powerful dreams that mark epochs in a person's life. It was an 'end of the world' dream, which psychologically is a special category, and without going into the details of it, one of the final scenes was where I was in an underground shelter after the first stages in a series of cataclysmic world-level explosions. Someone had set up this underground shelter with provisions and emergency equipment. They turned on the teevee and there was some guy, some anchorman, reciting some calming, general information about what was happening, and yet it seemed false or incomplete. When I stepped forward and looked closer at the teevee I was shocked to discover that instead of a filmed image in a studio (i.e. 'real'), it was really an extremely well-produced cartoon of an anchorman delivering the news. The weird thing is that this was years before teevee went digital and it was only years after that dream that all teevee productions, and especially news programs, began to take on that look, such for example we all saw during the First Gulf War (which of course was written about extensively by media studies people).

Let us suppose that I agree with you that 'people need to wake up'. But as they 'wake up' they rise up through all sorts of different levels of dream, and their perception is still dreamy, still mystified, and they still react to events like they have been trained to react by teevee and by movies: awed paranoia and powerlessness. The thing is that no one seems to know, definitively, what 'waking up' is or what the awake are then supposed to do. And also, those who suppose they are 'awake', what if they are just in another level of dream, daybrown? What if you and me and others are, in fact, presenting stories that are not much more than different levels of dream?

That is why I have the feeling that we cannot disregard the psychological dimension in 'all this'. It is now very, very strange what 'people' seem to 'think', and it will likely get stranger. And if some potent movement arises to capture their perceptions, or some messenger who embodies an old, potent archetype, now submerged and dormant, and pulls us and them into a sort of messianism or heaven knows what? Well, the ride will only get stranger. You say that 'people need to wake up' but what if it turns out they need to be kept dreaming, but dreaming better dreams?
Well shit Alex. I responded to this already, and it went into the ozone. But agreed, we are no more than forms in a 3D projected virtual reality. The software I operate with is kinda buggy too.
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Alex Jacob
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Re: September 11, 2001

Post by Alex Jacob »

I am not sure what you wrote, or where it is. I have not gotten the impression that you have focussed much on the psychological question, and really I was trying to add to the conversation by writing in relation to the idea of 'waking up'.

What I have not been able to find, and am curious about, are webpages and activism started by victim's families. Ceretainly they are the ones with many good reasons, and a lot of emotional fuel, to push for the opening up of the issue.

Here's one, though.
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Re: September 11, 2001

Post by daybrown »

Alex Jacob wrote:I am not sure what you wrote, or where it is. I have not gotten the impression that you have focussed much on the psychological question, and really I was trying to add to the conversation by writing in relation to the idea of 'waking up'.

What I have not been able to find, and am curious about, are webpages and activism started by victim's families. Ceretainly they are the ones with many good reasons, and a lot of emotional fuel, to push for the opening up of the issue.

Here's one, though.
Epictetus:"When a man shows me I was wrong, I am grateful not to be thinking wrongly. But whenever I perform the same service for another, he goes away angry." Dr. Freud noted that when you shatter a neurotic's delusion, he likewise, is angry, not grateful. Well, now if the whole population wakes up to the truth, they too will be pissed.

And damn dangerous. So, I cant say that I want the sheeple to wake up. If the decline in the middle class incomes continue, and the foreclosure rates drive down housing prices below the equity sheeple thot they had, they are likely to wake up angry. history is abundant with examples of demagogues who get them to start dragging the bastards out to be shot.

I dont see anything we can do about that. Try not to be in the way. The zeitgeist is changing in other ways as well. The Christian leadership we've had has dissolusioned lotsa Christians. Lotsa the young people I know are no longer Christian, fed up with the hypocrisy, and like Native Americans, looking into their Native European Spiritual roots. Which has something to do with the number of times today I've seen "Yo Saturnalia".

At least, that's what I see in the 3D projected matrix I live on. YMMV. There are a myriad worlds, maybe yours is more hopeful. I read where the NY Times reported the 911 commissioners saying they were lied to by the CIA. Then, NPR radio told me the same thing. The official narrative may be breaking down even without severe economic problems.

I dont expect the 911 commissioners and the corporate media to admit they lied to us, but I can see them starting to setup the CIA as scapegoats, as with Iraqi WMD, saying that they were lied to. But whatever, we didnt get the truth, and this is making more, young people especially, go online to find out what really happened.

I always doubted the official 911 report, but didnt see any point in trying to challenge it online. But then someone sent me the 'Loose Change' video, and I realized there was a kind of unseen mass movement going on, and so another change in the zeitgeist is how the defenders of the 911 report are now seen as the real whackos.
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Tomas
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Re: September 11, 2001

Post by Tomas »

prince wrote:I can not, and will not let this pass. I have been screwed in the head from this. Totally and Royally screwed in the head.

I am so disgusted about what happened that day, even now. There is not a day goes by, when I don't think of this.

So fuck you, terrorists, cunts, you did a number on my head for sure. Happy now, you spineless fucks? Eat your karmic shit you turds.
Thanks for the input.
Last edited by Tomas on Tue Jul 07, 2009 7:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re:

Post by Animus »

Unidian wrote:The facts as I see them, greatly compressed, are as follows:

1. WTC 7 appears to have almost certainly been a case of controlled demolition. No official report is able to dispute this convincingly, all official accounts are forced by the laws of physics to give collapse by fire only a "low probability of occurrence," and even many critics of 9/11 conspiracy theories admit that it appears to be a demolition when pressed on the issue. No steel-frame skyscraper in the world has undergone total collapse due to fire before or since. There were not even any plans in place to deal with such an occurrence, as it was previously considered structurally impossible. WTC 7 was not hit by any airliner, nor is there any significant evidence that it was severely damaged by falling debris, despite various assertions to the contrary.

The WTC 7 Collapse:

http://911research.wtc7.net/mirrors/gua ... -small.gif

2. Controlled demolition in any phase of the 9/11 events, in any building, establishes insider foreknowledge of the attacks with a great deal of certainty.

3. Foreknowledge indicates complicity on the part of at least some official agencies.

4. If this doesn't at least raise serious questions, one is probably either a highly indoctrinated individual, or a rather thoughtless one.
Or WTC7 was rigged with a failsafe after the previous attacks on WTC and Silverstein gave the "pull it" order, as he readily admitted it. This scenario does not indicate Federal foreknowledge.
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D. C. Commuter Crash

Post by Tomas »

.


D.C. Commuter Crash Kills General Who Scrambled Jets on 9/11

http://news.yahoo.com/s/bloomberg/20090 ... u5lx16vtk8
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Tomas
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Israel did 9/11

Post by Tomas »

.


Israel did 9/11, all the proof in the world

LOTSA PHOTOS OF THE VILLIANS

Who leased the WTC only seven weeks before 9/11?

Larry had breakfast in "Windows on the World" restaurant every single morning.
On 9/11 he never showed up. Neither did his daughter who worked in Building 7.

http://theinfounderground.com/forum/vie ... 367#p20823
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The National Security Generation

Post by Tomas »

.


The National Security Generation

"When an opponet declares, 'I will not come over to your side,' I say calmly, 'Your child belongs to us already...What are you? You will pass on. Your descendants, however, now stand in the new camp. In a short time they will know nothing but this new community,'"- - Adolph Hitler

Our children who were born on or around September 11, 2001 are now almost eight years old.

Our High Schools & the National Security Curriculum

As we said, children are the future. This article details the current
status of our youth as defined by the state
. (see photos)

http://123realchange.blogspot.com/2009/ ... art-i.html
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Re: September 11, 2001

Post by Carl G »

Bohemian Grove: Illuminati Meet This Week for Satanic Rituals

by Henry Makow Ph.D.

"The Satanist cult that has colonized mankind is meeting this week at Bohemian Grove 80 miles north of San Francisco.

"Over 2000 members -- the political, corporate, cultural and military elite of the world -- will be gathered for Satanic rituals, possibly including human ritual sacrifice. They have been meeting here since the 1880's."
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Is Ron Paul a 9/11 Truther?

Post by Tomas »

.


Is Ron Paul a 9/11 Truther?

The telling dodge happens 53 seconds in.

http://www.gop12.com/2009/07/is-ron-pau ... uther.html
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Carl G
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Re: September 11, 2001

Post by Carl G »

Jim Marrs on 9/11

World famous researcher and author of Crossfire [about JFK], Alien Agenda, Rule by Secrecy, The Terror Conspiracy, PSI Spies, The Rise of the Fourth Reich, and Above Top Secret, weighs in on the black operation that changed the world, in this short but potent video.
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Re: September 11, 2001

Post by 1456200423 »

veritas odium parit
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Carl G
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Re: September 11, 2001

Post by Carl G »

Terrorism a la 9/11.
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Pincho Paxton
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Re: September 11, 2001

Post by Pincho Paxton »

This video is strange. WT7 footage.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5qWFVzBdM5s

I'll say no more than that, but err that's not natural. I've seen it lots of times before, but didn't know what I do now.
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Pincho Paxton
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Re: September 11, 2001

Post by Pincho Paxton »

I'm a bit cautious about conspiracy theories since the moon landing confusion was fixed in Mythbusters. But there is something seriously wrong with WT7. I have posted the last video again, but then compare it with the simulations in the second link half way down.

I'll tell you what is completely unreal about the real footage. The building collapses from the top down. Actually it does it in three strange squashing motions.First the left is squashed, and then the right is squashed, and then the whole body is squashed. That's just very unusual. Now I am trying to think how that would happen. But at the same time as the top squashes down, huge flames shoot out of the windows. I mean, an example of that sort of destruction would happen if you stomped on the building 3 times. Also the flat rubble suggests stomping on the building. The other alternative to stomping would be 3 implosions sucking the building inwards, but I watched lots of footage of imploding buildings, and none of them sucked the square sections above the building inwards. All of the demolitions that I watched kept the square sections intact all the way down just like in the simulation that I have posted. Even in the simulation of WT7 on the right keeps the square sections in tact.

So this stomping, and the stomping of Crop Circles, led me to crop circles again. I went back to the very first crop circles. The first 20 are all the same pattern. We send you a message from inside the sun. Apparently a message from a black hole, and they live the other side of it. A sort of reverse Universe to our own.

So if you like conspiracy theories, this is a big one. Thing is.. it's too strange to make any sense. I want Mythbusters back again. Lol!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5qWFVzBdM5s

http://tyrannyalert.com/800.html

I also remeber a crop circle of a devil sitting on top of a building. I would like to see that again, but I can't find it.

I'm still puzzled... How the hell does a building collapse from the top first, to the bottom last?
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Pincho Paxton
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Re: September 11, 2001

Post by Pincho Paxton »

Here's my reconstruction....
Image
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Re: September 11, 2001

Post by 1456200423 »

Please take your seat and fasten your seat belt. And also make sure your seat back and folding trays are in their full upright position.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B2INIOXe_WI
Richard Gage AIA appeared on New Zealand's government owned (0) television station, TVNZ, on 27 November 2009.

In this interview on the "Close Up" program, Gage lays out the overwhelming evidence for controlled demolition of 3 WTC office towers on 11 September 2009.

This may be the first time the evidence assembled by Gage and others in the 9/11 truth movement has been presented with the gravity and respect it deserves by any mainstream news broadcaster.
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Pincho Paxton
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Re: September 11, 2001

Post by Pincho Paxton »

It's suspicious, but exploding the supports does not collapse the top section, and he says that they would have to explode the supports all at the same time.
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Re: September 11, 2001

Post by Carl G »

Suspicious?? You blow the supports.
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