Nuthin'

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Unidian
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Re: Nuthin'

Post by Unidian »

It's probably because he actually values your opinion. He has most likely written Sue off as a QRS fundamentalist, so her criticism isn't going to sting much.
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Carl G
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Re: Nuthin'

Post by Carl G »

Okay, then.

Laird, love is a trap. Emotions are a mine-field. They are a see-saw whirlygig amusement park in which we can live our whole lives in the push/pull of highs and lows. If we wish to transcend the sufferings that come along with the epiphanies, we must examine our behavior and possibly re-evaluate the value of the feeeelings, and especially the place they have in the scheme of our lives. So long as we remain addicted to the feelings and to the ideas behind them, we are no more than slaves to nature. If we have the potential and can summon the will, we can lead ourself -- and thereby the world -- into a saner existence.
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Re: Nuthin'

Post by xerox »

...
Last edited by xerox on Wed Jun 17, 2009 1:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Laird
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Re: Nuthin'

Post by Laird »

Carl, thank you for finally saying something substantial in your own words. That's all that I've been looking for mate. There's a lot that I want to say but I've injured my left arm (showing off how fast I could run to some fun little kids except my legs collapsed from under me on the tarmac - humbling) and it hurts too much to type with it. I don't have the patience to compose long one-handed posts. I'll get back to you when I heal. Hopefully that will be days, but realistically it might be weeks.

hsandman, if you're reading this then please know that I read through the links that you provided in the world without war thread. Thoroughly interesting mate. I read the conspiracy one twice. Again, I have lots that I want to say in response but it will have to wait until I heal.

Likewise, Sam, please consider our exchange in "Does it matter or not?" to be temporarily postponed.

For the next little while I'm on reading duties only. Feel free to pillory me in my absence. :-P Particularly you might want to say something like: "You idiot, you deserve that injury for being a show-off."
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Re: Nuthin'

Post by hsandman »

Laird wrote:hsandman, if you're reading this then please know that I read through the links that you provided in the world without war thread. Thoroughly interesting mate. I read the conspiracy one twice. Again, I have lots that I want to say in response but it will have to wait until I heal..
I am glad you did read it,(as I knew you would :-P) and I bet, to you 99% of that article sounds like fantasy, conjured out of mad-mans dreams, but I assure you, that all of those things check out.
Don't just take my word or his word for it, take some time while your hand heals and follow up on what he claims. I think your heart is in the right place, with good logic problem solving abilities and able to follow and stick to your own conclusions. As Holmes says to Watson, "Eliminate all that is impossible, whatever remains is the explanation, however improbable."... I think Carl selects his targets for ridicule out of hope more than malice. Looking forward on what you have to say on the subject. :-)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wS7CZIJVxFY
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Alex Jacob
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Re: Nuthin'

Post by Alex Jacob »

Carl G wrote:

"Laird, love is a trap. Emotions are a mine-field. They are a see-saw whirlygig amusement park in which we can live our whole lives in the push/pull of highs and lows. If we wish to transcend the sufferings that come along with the epiphanies, we must examine our behavior and possibly re-evaluate the value of the feeeelings, and especially the place they have in the scheme of our lives. So long as we remain addicted to the feelings and to the ideas behind them, we are no more than slaves to nature. If we have the potential and can summon the will, we can lead ourself -- and thereby the world -- into a saner existence."

The part I essentially disagree with is 'and thereby the world'. The way I look at it, it seems very unlikely that 'the world' in this sense (all wrapped up in 'the gunas' and caught in the 'modes of nature') is ever going to show willingness to change. The generations come and go and, in fact, nothing changes, and perhaps it just gets more raw.

After all, it is through the whole process of 'love' that entities come together and reproduce. If you are going to propose that the 'modes of nature' shall change, it is tantamount to saying that Nature is all on the sudden going to change and operate according to different laws, and in that sense all the world of Nature is a labyrinth of mad pursuit, chemical attractions, misrepresentation and lies. You will never change Nature and it is doubtful that the human world is going to change that much. The Roman Catholic project in Europe has basically been one of attempting to tame and restrain and control very basic human instincts, and doing that you wind up with a repressed figure who is ill-equipped to deal effectively with life. And if that whole methodology is destructive, it leads one to ask in what way we can channel what is our essential nature, tied to nature and the natural modes as it is. We have come into this world through these 'modes of nature' and we are an expression of these 'modes of nature'.

I tend to go along with what Uniden wrote in his post above:

"The normal, healthy, functional state of the human being includes a full range of emotional engagement. While this undoubtedly causes and exacerbates all sorts of problems, progress cannot occur without it. Conflict is the engine of progress. Perhaps in a parallel universe, there is some strange world where everyone is a super-sage living in a tub without the slightest emotional engagement. But such a world is not progressive. Nothing is improved because nothing is perceived as wrong. A world in which "absolute ultimate truth" is available is a dead world."

There is another level, and that level is learning how to deal with the world as it is, and to deal with women as they are, and to take hold of and manage one's emotional and idealistic side (the chemical drugs that cause us to mistake the false for something true). Mostly what 'concerns' me about some of what Laird expresses---his unreal idealism about a substantially dangerous game---is that it is innocent, even a little naive. Romanticism in men, in my opinion, is emasculation. It is hard to look at this idealism and this emotionalism in a harsher light (for example, as is expressed in La Rochefoucauld's maxims where our cleverly disguised 'self-love' is exposed), but it will enable us to handle women and our involvements with them, and not to be unnecessarily duped by these trecherous 'modes of nature'.
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Re: Nuthin'

Post by brokenhead »

Sue wrote:Sue: You keep imagining you’re onto something with this idea of love as an independent concept. If you thought about it, you’d see that you’re not. All you’re doing is ignoring what is in front of your very eyes – that EVERYTHING is interdependent.
And you keep imagining you have a monopoly on truth and understanding. This idea that love is not different in kind from baser, more human stuff is abrogating your duties as a child of God. Just as DHodges has pointed out about me and firearms - if I'm not comfortable with owning one and am unwilling to take the responsibility of learning to use one correctly, that I am better off unarmed - so should you not preach about love, as you belittle its power and equivocate it with jealousy, anger, and hatred.
Sue wrote:Love doesn’t just sit there all by itself waiting to be called upon to perform. It’s constantly out there hustling and bustling along with all the other emotions.
In fact, love is always at the ready to be called upon. If it is merely hustling and bustling, as you put it, that's only because you have not learned how to love correctly. It takes practice, Sue. Just like training with a handgun: you don't hit the bullseye straight away, you're lucky even to be in the vicinity of the target.
Sue wrote:Laird can't be expected to answer these questions, for his attachment to these matters blind him to the reasons behind them.
Really? I expect him to answer them bcause he has been answering them. Laird's not the blind one, Sue. You don't seem to understand that your ability to cut to the quick, to reach conclusions so swiftly, is because you are wearing blinders like a champion philly at the gate. You may win thus win a race, but it's the ones who have put on your blinders and ridden you who take home the prize money and the trophy.
Laird wrote:Truth to me is that love and respect are the best way, and that all emotions that lead me in that direction should be fostered, and that all emotions that lead me in a different direction should be rationalised away (insofar as that is possible).
It couldn't be simpler or better said.
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Carl G
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Re: Nuthin'

Post by Carl G »

Alex Jacob wrote:
If we have the potential and can summon the will, we can lead ourself -- and thereby the world -- into a saner existence."
The part I essentially disagree with is 'and thereby the world'. The way I look at it, it seems very unlikely that 'the world' in this sense (all wrapped up in 'the gunas' and caught in the 'modes of nature') is ever going to show willingness to change.The generations come and go and, in fact, nothing changes, and perhaps it just gets more raw.
I see your cynicism and raise you one practical reality check.

The world does change through the actions of the individual. My world changes if I do, and "the world" cannot help but follow, to a small but measurable degree.

"Be the change you want to see in the world." Do you disagree with Gandhi's words? It is a very simple concept.
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Unidian
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Re: Nuthin'

Post by Unidian »

+1
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Alex Jacob
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Re: Nuthin'

Post by Alex Jacob »

"Be the change you want to see in the world." Do you disagree with Gandhi's words? It is a very simple concept."

My viewpoint is a 'tragic' viewpoint, but in no way does it trump your view. The world is a strange place that plays by its own rules. It will likely go its way, as it has always. It may or not decide to mend its ways or to change. Though we have been raised in a sea of futuristic, fantasy-based idealism, and though we seem to assume the world tends in this direction, there is no guarantee that this is so. Nevertheless, we have an opportunity to live our values even if all that we value shall be crushed to little peices and all our works are in vain.

I sense in some of the writers here, those who more or less agree with the GF party-line, that they part of a vanguard 'leading the world to a better place'. Many of Sue's formulations are couched in such an assumption.

People are born into this place, it seems to me, because it gives them a platform to play out their romantic, sensual longings and hopes. I am not sure if our choices are going to have much of an effect on that.
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Carl G
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Re: Nuthin'

Post by Carl G »

You are talking about sea change. I speak of micro-change. I am interested in creating positive change in my corner. I am unconcerned with the general trend. My concern is my own quality of life. The whole world cannot help but be raised by my efforts, by definition. The entire Cosmos, for that matter. This isn't fantasy. It's scientific, it's logical. There is no way you, Alex can rain on this parade. Can you stop the inevitable?
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Unidian
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Re: Nuthin'

Post by Unidian »

It isn't necessary to stop the inevitable. One need only deny it to be rid of it in their own psychology.

Why would anyone want to do so? The list of potential reasons could be miles long. It's enough simply to know that there are many people who would rather not believe that humanity is moving forward or that one's own actions (or lack thereof) have an impact on that progressive movement in terms of either advancing or retarding it.
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Re:Ugh.. Nuthin'

Post by hsandman »

Ugh.. Let me see if I understand this... so what you saying is:
Unidan wrote:
It isn't necessary to stop the inevitable.
One need only deny it to be rid of it in their own psychology.
ie: deny = forget. gotcha ;-)

Unidan wrote: Why would anyone want to do so?
(please? volunteers? anyone?)
Unidan wrote:The list of potential reasons could be miles long.


(I am too lazy to look at all of them I am dyslexic.)
Unidan wrote:.. It's enough simply to know that there are many people (many.. many!)
Unidan wrote:.. who would rather not believe that....
(and since they are the mojority, I will rely on them to provide me with everything..even answers.)
Unidan wrote: humanity is moving forward
(undeniable fact)
Unidan wrote:.. or that ... one's own actions (or lack thereof )
ie: inactions.
Unidan wrote:have an impact
(or else the world with everything in it ie: conciseness etc. also would be meaningless right?)

(Does the internet make you stupid?
No it doesn't. Stupid people still can't find things. Having information available does not make people stupid it makes them smarter. The same argument could have been used for Libraries. Clever people just know how to make effective use of resources and get to the solution faster. )
Unidan wrote:.. have an impact... on that progressive movement in terms of either advancing or retarding it.
Ugh, What's : "a progressive movement?" O_o

Do you know what is schizophrenia? What you call a disease where the "evil voices" do not come from with in the head, but from behind a window? Showing you the garbage of the world.
You could shorten (the name of the virus)to something like ADD, ABC, NBC, NCC, FOX, etc. A virus that is not biological, but is memetical.

The simple Truth is, the American public is a deliberately dumb-ed-down population, who, by their actions, indicate they do not deserve to live in freedom. They are "easy pickins" for the intimidators of a growing Police State. The only thing Obama can change (besides his socks) is the face of evil. If he is elected you will still get the same tyranny and oppression but with a nice bright smile.

Stop watching the television, stop drinking the fluoride, stop injecting yourself and your children yearly with poisons.

The collective stupidity displayed by the public must be a direct result of all the chemical warfare that the NWO has been waging against US
.
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Unidian
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Re: Nuthin'

Post by Unidian »

Huh? I'm fairly sure you were trying to ridicule what I said in some way, but it was so incoherent that I missed all the zing. Could you reformulate in a more comprehensible manner, preferably without appending several superfluous paragraphs of paranoid NWO rambling plagiarized from Alex Jones?
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hsandman
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Re: Nuthin'

Post by hsandman »

Unidian wrote:Huh? I'm fairly sure you were trying to ridicule what I said in some way, but it was so incoherent that I missed all the zing. Could you reformulate in a more comprehensible manner, preferably without appending several superfluous paragraphs of paranoid NWO rambling plagiarized from Alex Jones?
Ugh... no?
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Unidian
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Re: Nuthin'

Post by Unidian »

Well, that was an honest reply. +1 for not even bothering. :)
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Alex Jacob
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Re: Nuthin'

Post by Alex Jacob »

Some people need a faith in a kind of linear idea of moral development to feel secure in the world and its processes, to know that things are progressing and getting better. If they don't have that sense it can lead to a sense of futility, and tends to put a damper on faith.

The processes that move the world are so strangely inscrutable! A butterfly flaps its wings in a paleozoic tropical paradise---and lo and behold the women of our age have very sophisticated masturbation devices! It's a mystery I tell you!

One of the strange 'facts of history' is that a given development, sometimes 'progressive', sometimes 'regressive', often produces some other and radically different result.

Why ever would you think (*snif*) that I would want to rain on your parade? I love parades! Yet I also love the rain. Where I am it has been raining constantly for the last 24 hours or so. Maybe you are picking up on that?

Uniden, I'll have you know that I have a very, VERY progressive psychology, one of the most progressive and upbeat that you will find.

[I am however convinced, beyond doubt, that Alex Jones has come about because of an unfortunate mishap in the cambrian age that was caused by the collision of two huge dragon-flies in what is now southern Romania. When it happened the whole cosmos went silent for about a half hour and the sky grew dark and it really seemed that the world knew that Alex Jones was gonna be the result].
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Unidian
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Re: Nuthin'

Post by Unidian »

I wasn't really referring to you, actually. However, now that you've apparently categorized my view as nothing more than faith, I probably will be more critical of your statements in the future. Faith is something I not only despise, but it is something of which I am constitutionally incapable. My views regarding progress don't stem from faith or a psychological desire to make the world a livable place for me. For one thing, progress occurs quite gradually and will be of no help during my brief lifetime. The Darwinistic cave-mentality will continue to dominate human culture until the day I die, so I'm not looking for any deliverance there. Secondly, it isn't wishful thinking which leads me to believe that progress does occur over long time scales. I have no respect for wishful thinking. Rather, it is an examination of history, which indicates that human quality of life has consistently improved across a variety of metrics over the centuries.

Nice crack about Alex Jones, though. ;)
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Alex Jacob
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Re: Nuthin'

Post by Alex Jacob »

Chill, oh ye of little [constitutional] faith. You have successfully made yourself understood.
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Carl G
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Re: Nuthin'

Post by Carl G »

Alex Jacob is a faker. I mean fakir. Fakir.

Oblique can be an excuse for not there. For nuthin.'

I want the goods. It's easy to say, "They're there, but you can't see 'em."

I'm like Uni. I want the goods. I go to Mickey D's, or wherever that TV ad says, and I tell 'em, "I want it my way."

Poetry? Who the fuck do you think I am, Alan Ginsburg? I ain't no gay queer.

When it comes to truth, I'm down, I'm straight, I'm ghetto.

So don't give me none of that candy-ass spirituality "I mean what I don't say, you got to read between the lines, and shit."

I ain't got no patience for that. I want the real deal. You deal with that.
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Unidian
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Re: Nuthin'

Post by Unidian »

In that case, Carl, I think you're ready for the secret Inner Teachings.

http://www.geocities.com/pathways2eden/ ... ityDevice/
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hsandman
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Re: Nuthin'

Post by hsandman »

Unidan wrote:Well, that was an honest reply. +1 for not even bothering. :)
You're welcome. =)
Carl wrote:I ain't got no patience for that. I want the real deal. You deal with that.
Catchy. You should be in advertising! ;-)

Edit:
Bit slow on the up-take. :-/
Carl wrote:Alex Jacob is a faker. I mean fakir. Fakir.
I hate the INDIVIDUAL Fckers/fuckers/fakirs/fakers in that tribe who do this. Same as in any other tribe for the same reason.
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Alex Jacob
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Re: Nuthin'

Post by Alex Jacob »

You cats are soooooooooo wierd.

I give up! I'm grabbing Kirkegaard's autobiography, the Teachings of Ramakrishna, a random mathematical treatise or two and I'm headin' back to the eucalyptus forest of my youth. I'm gonna take acid and listen to the kookaburra's song, it's the only thing that makes sense anymore...
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Tomas
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Nuthin' but the best '25'

Post by Tomas »

.


-Rabbi slobbers-
Alex Jacob - You cats are soooooooooo wierd.

-tomas yaps-
It's weird, not wierd.
I before E except after C and sometimes Y and W.

Anyways. The common housecat is an introduced species to the Americas. Upon gaining the presidency (one way or another), my first act would be the "forced removal" of housecats from every household, pet shop, humane society, barnyard, and the forests and meadows. Governor Michael Vick will know what to do with those damned critters.




-Rabbi-
I give up!

-tomas surmises-
I figured you to be an easy pushover.




-Rabbi rants-
I'm grabbing Kirkegaard's autobiography, the Teachings of Ramakrishna,

-tomas-
Still chasing that elusive dead man's despotic dreams?




-Rabbi sniffs-
a random mathematical treatise or two

-tomas-
One two three red light.




-Rabbi threatens-
and I'm headin' back to the eucalyptus forest of my youth

-tomas-
Another one bites the dust.




-Rabbi the Rebel-
I'm gonna take acid

-tomas-
You know what happened to Nancy Reagan? She "tripped" ... then fell, almost broke a hip, now she's recuperating in the same room as her husband (Ronny) was, I see a future of Alzheimer's coming your way! Remember what Nancy said about drugs: Just Say No!
People want drugs, not hugs...




-Rabbi
and listen to the kookaburra's

-tomas-
Yeah, trying to relive the past thru drug use. No wonder Plato said kids were running wild in the streets.




-Rabbi further spouts-
song,

-tomas-
Bring along extra batteries (the good acid) and a solar cell recharger. Please do not dispose of the batteries in a detrimental way harmful to the environment. Elizabeth and Shahrazad will be on your case when you wake up from the trip.




-Rabbi dreams-
it's the only thing that makes sense anymore...

-tomas reflects-
Still watching the Cheech and Chong movies, huh...?




Tomas (the tank)
VietNam veteran - 1971



.
hsandman
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Re: Nuthin'

Post by hsandman »

Tomas
Elizabeth and Shahrazad will be on your case when you wake up from the trip.
I before E except after C and sometimes Y and W.
hsandman

I always contfuse these two queenz of the ninle.

[quote="Alex Jackob"][/quote]

Dirge of Cerberus: If Everyone Cared, Nobody Cried
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMmv8vN3wOU

Heh. Ups, there goes totality.

I before
E
except after
C anD
sometimes
Y and W.
wierd. lol we are freeking out these people surely?
What a big jocke! :-0
Answer is D.

Edit: Do you know, why I know, that hittler was into astrology? Because D stands for does not matter![/endsarcasm]
lol.
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