man's own thought

Discussion of the nature of Ultimate Reality and the path to Enlightenment.
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Maximiliano Vignaga
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man's own thought

Post by Maximiliano Vignaga »

Hello everyone,

I just noticed my own thoughts aren't really mine at all but come flying in like birds through a window.

I can control what kind of thoughts come in by changing my environment, like leaving a dangerous place, thus ending the thought "shit, I'm going to die!".

If I see myself in the mirror, a thought comes to my mind and says: "That's me!" I don't know where it came from, why it came, and who send it.

I did once see a snake lying on the ground, or so I thought. But after looking closely, it was just a branch.

My thoughts are always there, even now, writing this post about my thoughts.

"Me", "I", "this", "that", are all thoughts. It seems weird, but they don't have a place of their own. They just come to me.

.
Naturalist
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Re: man's own thought

Post by Naturalist »

There is no essence in who or what you are. There is no you in the so-called 'you' in the first place. Every event that arises be it consciously or otherwise is merely a continuum of orientating flux of energy in the cosmos. The delusion of you arises because of the elements of memory, without it, there can be no consciousness in play. Therefore, it is wise not to conceptualise anything if one were to discover the true nature of everything.
Stuart-
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Re: man's own thought

Post by Stuart- »

When an animal's consciousness, which is first directed at what surrounds him, has more time and energy than it needs, it turns inward and it develops self-consciousness. It essentially meets itself for the first time. It begins to know itself as that which is like others of its own species, but not to be related to in the same way.

A monkey sees itself in the mirror and sees a threat or a potential ally. It hasn't excess energy to develop self-consciousness. An ape will recognize himself in the mirror, and thereby know that what he sees is not a threat, but a friend, but a type of friend that he needn't deal with as other friends. He knows he is it.

A more advanced animal, such as a human, doesn't just become conscious of his outer self - his body, he becomes conscious of his mind. He becomes conscious of being conscious. He can then become further conscious of being conscious of being conscious and so on. But, initially when first becoming conscious of being conscious, he may see that consciousness as the monkey sees his reflection. He may see it as another.

He knows very well that his reflection in the mirror isn't another, and he knows his body, arms and legs as he looks down on himself aren't parts of another. So he knows that the consciousness he's conscious of is oriented through his body, but that doesn't stop him from considering it to be of a different mind. He may then consider the presumed other mind to have any origin he chooses. He may believe that a different person is co-inhabiting his body as well as another body, or that the presumed other mind is an entity with no body of its own, which may inhabit many bodies. He may see it as a God-mind.

He may see it as an all-powerful absolute God-mind, or as some pagans may have seen it, which is as the bodiless manifestation of his ancestors. The latter isn't too fantastical an idea because he has in actuality inherited the bodies of his ancestors.
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Cahoot
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Re: man's own thought

Post by Cahoot »

Ever see an unrecognizable reflection in the mirror?

In the space of a heartbeat or two, the relationship between awareness and the image in the mirror moves from unrecognizable, to blank, to recognizable.

These stages apply to anything that is recognizable, e.g. dog or tree. Any of these stages can be prolonged beyond what is normal. Any stage prolonged beyond what is normal, or customary, is a change. Change gets noticed.

Usually the stages blend seamlessly and thus are not noticed. The two stages before recognition are discounted by awareness because seamless is swift, and recognition has already moved on with life. But the blank space does exist in the moment before recognition.

Sometimes that blank space is prolonged indefinitely (if you have them, refer to memories of a senile person searching for a thought.) This blank space is where thought appears. It appears between unrecognizable and recognizable.
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Diebert van Rhijn
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Re: man's own thought

Post by Diebert van Rhijn »

Maximiliano Vignaga wrote:Hello everyone,

I just noticed my own thoughts aren't really mine at all but come flying in like birds through a window.

I can control what kind of thoughts come in by changing my environment, like leaving a dangerous place, thus ending the thought "shit, I'm going to die!".

If I see myself in the mirror, a thought comes to my mind and says: "That's me!" I don't know where it came from, why it came, and who send it.

I did once see a snake lying on the ground, or so I thought. But after looking closely, it was just a branch.

My thoughts are always there, even now, writing this post about my thoughts.

"Me", "I", "this", "that", are all thoughts. It seems weird, but they don't have a place of their own. They just come to me.
Hi there! Welcome.

It sounds almost as if you're removed from your self and are watching a play, some fireworks of the mind. It's a very interesting state but it would still be an illusion because such vantage point can be found out not to be real: just an artifact of the particular perspective you've embraced. For example the notion of something "not being really mine" is just the mirror to "being really mine". In the end those thoughts are all there is to "mine" and "not mine". Outside that dualism, there's really no question like that possible. In other words: the observing is somewhat of a kidding of oneself. But a very powerful state where it can indeed be seen how things come and go, when causality comes alive and leaves us flabbergasted as witness.
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