Fulfilling all prophecies

Discussion of the nature of Ultimate Reality and the path to Enlightenment.
jufa
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Fulfilling all prophecies

Post by jufa »

I ask myself, jufa, what can we achieve in our happiness of misery, knowing we entered this world with nothing, and will leave as we entered, NAKED AND CONFUSED? The joy, the pain, the good, the bad are attached to what then? DNA inheritance. Why strive for enlightenment, bliss, or a higher conscious order when we are born to die?
Man's purpose is to become aware the expand of conscious truth is the reason why men entered this interval of awareness as the Spark of the Circle of Pure Awareness. They are Messengers crying in the wilderness. Shouting to the world, that in the continuum of the moment one is conscious/unconsciously awaken, all is fulfill by the good of evil and the evil of good moving within the moment one is living. That the purpose of enlightenment is to "abolish[ed] in his flesh, the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace.” THERE IT IS, making the two personalities one new man. Fulfilling all prophecies.

Extracted from the manuscript "ARE YOU READY" - BY JULIUS FANN, JR.
Our individual universe of thought would not exist if it were pure and perfect. But that is the catch, isn't it, the claim it is ours? The universe and all chaos existed before any sentient being's awareness. Before man's agreement or opposition in thought interpretation of religion, psychiatry, philosophy, creationism or evolution speculations, as well as moral and spiritual integrity. How then can men lay claim to any adjustment of any situation, circumstance of their awareness of it, being they have no logic or reasoning why creation has included the sentient being as a bit and piece of it, or any part of it? This is not our universe, our world contains perspective, opinions, ideas, prejudices, and all that jazz? It is man's arrogance of believing he does not have to acknowledge and adhere to the Order of creation's Principled Substance and Pattern Essence of the Law of Rules which govern every element of creation.

The fullness of time expires the illusion of God and man. Death voids all religion, philosophy, and psychological yahooing of one observer, only to become attached to another observer who will not change the world, only die as the first observers, NAKED AND CONFUSED.

Has anyone considered, being the observed observer, the supposed intellectual master of their life, awareness of the demise of time, space, distance and matter, for the individual, is a lesson to be learned? Learned the lesson of, "the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitations." Which is the lesson of self-condemnation taught by angels who were themselves the self-condemned.

Should there be an opinion, speculation, or theory forthcoming, I know it will go beyond any human philosophy and show me how to get out of this world alive.

Never give power to anything a person believe is their source of strength - jufa

http://theillusionofgod.yuku.com
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GreatandWiseTrixie
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Re: Fulfilling all prophecies

Post by GreatandWiseTrixie »

My question to you, is why do you wish to cling to this life so bad if you say you are so miserable?

>>>>>>>>>>>>>Why strive for "insert thing here" when we are going to die?
Why go on a roller coaster that only lasts for 5 minutes. To start living in the moment...

Dying is the ultimate purpose of life...non-existence...We love the feeling of non-existence, it is our favorite feeling...just being in the moment, not thinking...Idiocy and ignorance drives this world.

"why creation has included any sentient being in it"
My interpretation (if you are religious) is God got bored and made a sandbox crap world for His entertainment.
My other interpretation (if you are agnostic) is this is only a universe of billions of universes. Which means, sentience exists in this universe, simply because we would not be in a universe that did not have the right conditions to produce sentience. Which means, there will always be sentience, because if there wasn't, we wouldn't experience the lack of sentience.

Energy is neither created nor destroyed. I like to think of Death as just a "level up exp" as in a videogame where you temporarily level down to get more exp in the long run. Chances are in your next life you retain some of your past essence. Hopefully, you go to Heaven, or a nicer planet than this world, or maybe we have to reincarnate a few times to put up with and fix the abominable human species and how they ruined everything. Maybe when you die you respawn as someone with DNA similar to your own. Or just go to Heaven. Either way, there's no reason to be ashamed of being naked.
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SeekerOfWisdom
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Re: Fulfilling all prophecies

Post by SeekerOfWisdom »

How hard is it really... misery, evil, joy, the pain, the good, the bad, born, dying, all meaningless terms.

Get that through the thickness, meaning-making.

"It is man's arrogance of believing he does not have to acknowledge and adhere to the Order of creation's Principled Substance and Pattern Essence of the Law of Rules which govern every element of creation."

"the Order of creation's Principled Substance and Pattern Essence of the Law of Rules"

Can you link me to this law? I don't want to get a fine.
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Diebert van Rhijn
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Re: Fulfilling all prophecies

Post by Diebert van Rhijn »

SeekerOfWisdom wrote:How hard is it really... misery, evil, joy, the pain, the good, the bad, born, dying, all meaningless terms.
And so it would also be meaningless to think of them as meaningless.

Wrap your mind around that! And then abandon that silly, deprecating, truth-avoiding position that is about to collapse.
Bobo
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Re: Fulfilling all prophecies

Post by Bobo »

SeekerOfWisdom wrote:Can you link me to this law? I don't want to get a fine.
Hehehe that's funny, but you're gonna die, not get a fine.
SeekerOfWisdom wrote:How hard is it really... misery, evil, joy, the pain, the good, the bad, born, dying, all meaningless terms.
I agree that it's meaningless, as long as you do not, let's say, die.
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Re: Fulfilling all prophecies

Post by SeekerOfWisdom »

Diebert van Rhijn wrote:
SeekerOfWisdom wrote:How hard is it really... misery, evil, joy, the pain, the good, the bad, born, dying, all meaningless terms.
And so it would also be meaningless to think of them as meaningless.

Wrap your mind around that! And then abandon that silly, deprecating, truth-avoiding position that is about to collapse.
Ofcourse it is.

You almost quoted "It's empty and meaningless, that it's empty and meaningless."
Bobo wrote:
SeekerOfWisdom wrote:Can you link me to this law? I don't want to get a fine.
Hehehe that's funny, but you're gonna die, not get a fine.
SeekerOfWisdom wrote:How hard is it really... misery, evil, joy, the pain, the good, the bad, born, dying, all meaningless terms.
I agree that it's meaningless, as long as you do not, let's say, die.
There's a law that says I'm going to die?

I hate the government.
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GreatandWiseTrixie
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Re: Fulfilling all prophecies

Post by GreatandWiseTrixie »

SeekerOfWisdom wrote:How hard is it really... misery, evil, joy, the pain, the good, the bad, born, dying, all meaningless terms.

Get that through the thickness, meaning-making.

"It is man's arrogance of believing he does not have to acknowledge and adhere to the Order of creation's Principled Substance and Pattern Essence of the Law of Rules which govern every element of creation."

"the Order of creation's Principled Substance and Pattern Essence of the Law of Rules"

Can you link me to this law? I don't want to get a fine.
It's a duality, like most everything. From one perspective, it has meaning. From another perspective, it has a different meaning, or none at all. I am well aware of the perspective that emotions aren't real, I myself have what some would say a...certain...kind...of mind. But not bothering to look further just seems like a cop out to me.
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SeekerOfWisdom
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Re: Fulfilling all prophecies

Post by SeekerOfWisdom »

It's inherently meaningless.

Go as much further as you like, just know it's all meaning-making, don't become attached lest you cause yourself suffering or 'misery'.
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Re: Fulfilling all prophecies

Post by SeekerOfWisdom »

"am well aware of the perspective that emotions aren't real"

Great.

Though instead of the word real you can say "are in the realm of fantasy".

And it's not a perspective.
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GreatandWiseTrixie
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Re: Fulfilling all prophecies

Post by GreatandWiseTrixie »

SeekerOfWisdom wrote:"am well aware of the perspective that emotions aren't real"

Great.

Though instead of the word real you can say "are in the realm of fantasy".

And it's not a perspective.
it is a perspective, because if you ask a child, they will tell you that their emotions are real.
Go as much further as you like, just know it's all meaning-making, don't become attached lest you cause yourself suffering or 'misery'.
I already am suffering, well according to the common perception of the word, but since suffering is in the realm of fantasy, I'm not really suffering, or am I? It's a paradox. Truth is, I'm not really sure what the difference between happiness and misery really is. Because watching old movies, they give you the same chemicals as several years ago, but now all of a sudden you feel an aversion to the things you used to supposedly used to enjoy. But did you really enjoy them, or just believe you did, was your belief grounded in truth or delusion?
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SeekerOfWisdom
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Re: Fulfilling all prophecies

Post by SeekerOfWisdom »

Ofcourse it's real, but it's in the realm of fantasy. What I mean by that is, if you imagine Santa clause and for some reason it makes you depressed, then clearly that is delusional and in the realm of fantasy. The same holds true for all emotional suffering, it's just less obvious in some cases. A delusional child's perspective is a perspective, the truth remains whether he knows it or not.
SeekerOfWisdom
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Re: Fulfilling all prophecies

Post by SeekerOfWisdom »

If you think you're suffering than you're suffering.

If you think you're free than you're free.

'We are what we think, all that we are arises with our thoughts, with our thoughts we create the world".

Consider that quote, take it literally. Don't ask, was I suffering before or was I happy? you can't experience the past. "I let go of all that, and I am here. Be happy."
Bobo
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Re: Fulfilling all prophecies

Post by Bobo »

SeekerOfWisdom wrote: There's a law that says I'm going to die?
Not really like that, but is better than let's say burying people that are considered alive.
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GreatandWiseTrixie
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Re: Fulfilling all prophecies

Post by GreatandWiseTrixie »

SeekerOfWisdom wrote:Ofcourse it's real, but it's in the realm of fantasy. What I mean by that is, if you imagine Santa clause and for some reason it makes you depressed, then clearly that is delusional and in the realm of fantasy. The same holds true for all emotional suffering, it's just less obvious in some cases. A delusional child's perspective is a perspective, the truth remains whether he knows it or not.
my question to you is if someone murders your family is it real suffering or just a fantasy. if someone shoots your kneecap is it real or just fantasy. if someone deprives you from the internet for 5 days is the suffering real or just fantasy.
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SeekerOfWisdom
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Re: Fulfilling all prophecies

Post by SeekerOfWisdom »

GreatandWiseTrixie wrote:my question to you is if someone murders your family is it real suffering or just a fantasy. if someone shoots your kneecap is it real or just fantasy. if someone deprives you from the internet for 5 days is the suffering real or just fantasy.
Emotions are real. Suffering is real. Yet they are in the realm of fantasy, based on fantasy, caused by delusion, founded upon make-believe. If I didn't have internet I wouldn't suffer. If someone murdered my family perhaps I would for a little, but that would be a short-lived lapse in judgement. (Which of course, to the delusional, it's considered crazy not to cry and scream and act delusional and depressed in such a situation, which only outlines their lack of sanity)

Pain is pain, and most likely suffering, depending on its degree, but it passes. The majority of suffering is mental/psychological suffering.
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Diebert van Rhijn
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Re: Fulfilling all prophecies

Post by Diebert van Rhijn »

SeekerOfWisdom wrote:
Diebert van Rhijn wrote:
SeekerOfWisdom wrote:How hard is it really... misery, evil, joy, the pain, the good, the bad, born, dying, all meaningless terms.
And so it would also be meaningless to think of them as meaningless.

Wrap your mind around that! And then abandon that silly, deprecating, truth-avoiding position that is about to collapse.
O fcourse it is.

You almost quoted "It's empty and meaningless, that it's empty and meaningless."
Indeed I hinted at that generic self-help limerick from the 60's which Dennis liked to use to imply "depth" and "zen". But I was at least wise enough to add that it needs to be abandoned right away. Otherwise it becomes another excuse, like any other old liquor bottle, to remain drunk of self.
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Re: Fulfilling all prophecies

Post by SeekerOfWisdom »

It doesn't imply depth, it implies groundlessness.

The seeking for grounding is OK.
Nothing's broken.
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Diebert van Rhijn
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Re: Fulfilling all prophecies

Post by Diebert van Rhijn »

SeekerOfWisdom wrote:It doesn't imply depth, it implies groundlessness.
Would the most extreme depth not be groundless? Then again, it's easier to stir up the material bottom and imply that way: "hey can't see the floor, it must be deep and mysterious". But actual depth means transparency, clarity and a lot of room to swim. And this is a measurement for truth: the ability to clarify, to widen the gaze.
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Re: Fulfilling all prophecies

Post by Pam Seeback »

Trixie wrote: Dying is the ultimate purpose of life...non-existence...We love the feeling of non-existence, it is our favorite feeling...just being in the moment, not thinking...Idiocy and ignorance drives this world.
Thinking that thought reflects truth is the ignorance that drives this world. When one becomes wise to the true nature of thought, that is but a fleeting grasp of an imagined objective reality, they do not stop thinking, this is impossible, instead they know that their fleeting grasp is imagined and rest in this knowledge.

At first this allowing of the imagined grasp seems a betrayal of the truth, "thought is not reality, I want to be real, ergo, I must stop thinking" but in time, one comes to realize that their human sentient world cannot be managed without thought. There is a biblical scripture that refers to this resting in truth and illusion both: "I (truth of emptiness/spirit) am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in (into no-thought) and out (into thought), and find pasture." For me, there came a time when not only could I return to the illusory world of reasoning but also to the illusory world of feeling with the difference being that now I could enjoy them because they are a fleeting experience.
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GreatandWiseTrixie
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Re: Fulfilling all prophecies

Post by GreatandWiseTrixie »

movingalways wrote:
Trixie wrote: Dying is the ultimate purpose of life...non-existence...We love the feeling of non-existence, it is our favorite feeling...just being in the moment, not thinking...Idiocy and ignorance drives this world.
Thinking that thought reflects truth is the ignorance that drives this world. When one becomes wise to the true nature of thought, that is but a fleeting grasp of an imagined objective reality, they do not stop thinking, this is impossible, instead they know that their fleeting grasp is imagined and rest in this knowledge.

At first this allowing of the imagined grasp seems a betrayal of the truth, "thought is not reality, I want to be real, ergo, I must stop thinking" but in time, one comes to realize that their human sentient world cannot be managed without thought. There is a biblical scripture that refers to this resting in truth and illusion both: "I (truth of emptiness/spirit) am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in (into no-thought) and out (into thought), and find pasture." For me, there came a time when not only could I return to the illusory world of reasoning but also to the illusory world of feeling with the difference being that now I could enjoy them because they are a fleeting experience.
I don't think it is impossible to stop thinking. Theoretically, since all that is needed to exist is to feel, one could exist without any thought at all. (Theoretically.)
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Cahoot
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Re: Fulfilling all prophecies

Post by Cahoot »

GreatandWiseTrixie wrote:
movingalways wrote:
Trixie wrote: Dying is the ultimate purpose of life...non-existence...We love the feeling of non-existence, it is our favorite feeling...just being in the moment, not thinking...Idiocy and ignorance drives this world.
Thinking that thought reflects truth is the ignorance that drives this world. When one becomes wise to the true nature of thought, that is but a fleeting grasp of an imagined objective reality, they do not stop thinking, this is impossible, instead they know that their fleeting grasp is imagined and rest in this knowledge.

At first this allowing of the imagined grasp seems a betrayal of the truth, "thought is not reality, I want to be real, ergo, I must stop thinking" but in time, one comes to realize that their human sentient world cannot be managed without thought. There is a biblical scripture that refers to this resting in truth and illusion both: "I (truth of emptiness/spirit) am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in (into no-thought) and out (into thought), and find pasture." For me, there came a time when not only could I return to the illusory world of reasoning but also to the illusory world of feeling with the difference being that now I could enjoy them because they are a fleeting experience.
I don't think it is impossible to stop thinking. Theoretically, since all that is needed to exist is to feel, one could exist without any thought at all. (Theoretically.)
Regardless of an egoistic tendency to project one’s own limitations upon reality, of course it’s well within the capacity of mind. It is, in fact, a consequence of legitimate meditative practice (legitimate meaning other than one’s personal fantasy definition of meditation). :)
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GreatandWiseTrixie
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Re: Fulfilling all prophecies

Post by GreatandWiseTrixie »

Cahoot wrote:
GreatandWiseTrixie wrote:
movingalways wrote:
Trixie wrote: Dying is the ultimate purpose of life...non-existence...We love the feeling of non-existence, it is our favorite feeling...just being in the moment, not thinking...Idiocy and ignorance drives this world.
Thinking that thought reflects truth is the ignorance that drives this world. When one becomes wise to the true nature of thought, that is but a fleeting grasp of an imagined objective reality, they do not stop thinking, this is impossible, instead they know that their fleeting grasp is imagined and rest in this knowledge.

At first this allowing of the imagined grasp seems a betrayal of the truth, "thought is not reality, I want to be real, ergo, I must stop thinking" but in time, one comes to realize that their human sentient world cannot be managed without thought. There is a biblical scripture that refers to this resting in truth and illusion both: "I (truth of emptiness/spirit) am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in (into no-thought) and out (into thought), and find pasture." For me, there came a time when not only could I return to the illusory world of reasoning but also to the illusory world of feeling with the difference being that now I could enjoy them because they are a fleeting experience.
I don't think it is impossible to stop thinking. Theoretically, since all that is needed to exist is to feel, one could exist without any thought at all. (Theoretically.)
Regardless of an egoistic tendency to project one’s own limitations upon reality, of course it’s well within the capacity of mind. It is, in fact, a consequence of legitimate meditative practice (legitimate meaning other than one’s personal fantasy definition of meditation). :)
I don't have any definition of meditation, I was just telling you what I've been told, lol. What is the legitimate meaning of meditation?
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Cahoot
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Re: Fulfilling all prophecies

Post by Cahoot »

Why do you want to know that?
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GreatandWiseTrixie
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Re: Fulfilling all prophecies

Post by GreatandWiseTrixie »

Cahoot wrote:Why do you want to know that?
Why is such a certain kind of question...

When asked why, I often try to think of reason to justify the "why". Reasons and meanings. Which some would say, myself included, fleeting, changing, and even hollow or distorted or made up.

It is a question, I could tell you it's because of curiosity, or because I want to try new techniques, or novelty. Or hidden things I will not yet reveal.
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Cahoot
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Re: Fulfilling all prophecies

Post by Cahoot »

Ask and it shall be given.

So true. It happens every time.

And when you know what you are asking, you know what you are being given.
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