Mistakes

Discussion of the nature of Ultimate Reality and the path to Enlightenment.
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Cory Duchesne
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Mistakes

Post by Cory Duchesne »

The hardest part about learning from mistakes is actually acknowledging and understanding the mistakes. You can’t learn from a mistake if you don’t first see it. And it’s the seeing that hurts.

It’s nothing to be proud of to be a full grown adult and boast of only making 2 mistakes in ones life. The more mistakes you learn from, the greater the soul. More mistakes, more knowledge. More failure, more success. A man who has learned from a 100 mistakes is greater than a man who has learned from only 2 mistakes.

However, I’d rather be friends with a man who has learned from his mere 2 mistakes, than be friends with a guy who hasn’t learned anything from his 100.

What prevents us from being good people (through acknowledging mistakes) is pride, a lack of shame, and a poverty of idealism.

Pride is often an obstacle. Shame is the fuel for ascension. Intuition, Idealism and knowledge = a compass, a target, and a map.
Elizabeth Isabelle
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Re: Mistakes

Post by Elizabeth Isabelle »

Quite true Cory. I believe that this is the major reason why removing the ego as much as possible is important for wisdom. The second biggest reason would be to not make mistakes that one knows are mistakes going into a situation, but done anyway for egotistical pleasures.
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Ryan Rudolph
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Re: Mistakes

Post by Ryan Rudolph »

Since we are on the topic of mistakes, I will openly reiterate again as I have done previous that I do not believe I am living the full ideal of enlightenment, due to attachments in my life, and also my dependence on working for a ‘questionable’ company, which does create a self-protective vice, or sense of self-preservation, which I know is not ideal. However, to live the full ideal of enlightenment, one would probably have difficulty keeping employment in the business world. That is why I created a public persona on Facebook, which is not all that confrontational.

Facebook could be transformed to be of higher quality, it has potential, and if so, I could remove a lot of work contacts and family so that I do not to have to bother to explain some of the harsh philosophy to. I really don’t see the point, as these people have no interest in philosophy, and would only use the information against me to cause unnecessary hardship in my life. I am not ready to martyr myself to truth in this manner. Call it vice, call it vanity, call it self-preservation, but that is ‘what is’. Basically, to the degree that you desire to adapt to a corrupt society, it will create the same degree of corruption within you. it is a law, I see it, I recognize it, and I know its there.

However, in my own defense, I think after being exposed to wisdom, having attachments is not as severe, as I believe they have less of a stranglehold over your psyche, meaning if you refuse to idealize and project a certain future with women, children, and modern work life, and see it as it is in the life of the infinite, then it has less power over you. That is not to say that they have no power over you, just far less.

Basically, men have two very strong biological drives – the desire for female companionship/sex, and the desire for financial stability/decent living conditions, and these two drives are very powerful, they are hardwired. And so where you have the pursuit of these two drives, you will have some degree of compromise and therefore some degree of corruption.

Btw, I have made many more than 2 mistakes, who is the individual that only claimed 2?
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Cory Duchesne
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Re: Mistakes

Post by Cory Duchesne »

Ryan Rudolph wrote: Btw, I have made many more than 2 mistakes, who is the individual that only claimed 2?
A biological relative of mine. ;)

His boastful claim of 2 mistakes were related to money, investment stuff. Since he raised me, I experienced his carelessness and stupidity as a parent first hand - so it was quite aggravating to hear him boast of only 2 mistakes when I had the first hand experience of dozens of thoughtless actions imposed on me. On top of that, as a teenager, I felt like almost everything I did was a mistake, so I felt like either there was something really wrong with me, or something really wrong with him.

He's not like that anymore, his pride has definitely waned over the years, and is much more humble these days.

Regardless, Ryan, my apologizes for being a tad harsh in the other thread. However, you have to remember that who I am is the result of abnormal self hatred and aggression toward myself. Whoever gets too close to me and expresses the qualities I've hated in myself over the years, ends up on the receiving end of it, as a logical consequence of the values that guide me. If you're going to move with me, you have to stay sharp. I won't tolerate any attempts at taking weak leadership (e.g., criticizing lofty spiritual ideals, justifying weakness, painting a vice as a virtue, etc)

However, I don't believe in free will, so I will not judge you as long as you're not judging others and promoting false wisdom. Judging my audience or my experience on facebook is inappropriate. Be sure not to go into places you know nothing about.

Also, in the same way I got rough with you, I actually (mildly) yelled at Adam the other night, but I feel like my emotions are coming from a healthy attachment to truth. People who haven't walked the path completely have no right to criticize the ideals of the path. If I see anyone doing it, I'm shelling each and every one of you. Nothing personal, it's just that... if I'm going to let you into my life, my life is in your hands. If you're irresponsible and frivolous about your own mind, that irresponsibility is going to effect my life in someway. I'm not letting anyone act as a distraction, indulging in vain superficialities, and screwing up what we're all working for. At times, maybe I'm being paranoid and making too much of a fuss. But I assure you, if you're not careful, cautious and humble, you will harm me, yourself and truth itself.
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Cory Duchesne
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Re: Mistakes

Post by Cory Duchesne »

But more about mistakes. Keep in mind, when I write this I am not directing this at you Ryan, or anyone in particular. What I am saying here is applicable to every one of us, it's universal.

Mistake. The word itself is interesting, with the emphasis on "take". Life is very much a "taking" for oneself. But what are you taking and why? For instance... right now. I am taking your time. Is this my mis-take? Or a right-take? What's the motivation behind the taking? As worldly people, the motivation is often submission to persons, a group or a loved one. I could just as easily say it's an attempt to dominate, but in that attempt to dominate, one typically submits to something worldly. Submission comes first, that is the root. Then, from that submission, one tries to dominate.

We have less painful ways of pointing out submission... we often call it "drawing attention to oneself", "trying to belong", "seeking approval", "being accepted by the mother", "returning to the womb". In an immature stage of consciousness, if we're honest with ourselves, we really have very little to give. Often, the thing we have to give is rather destructive and poisonous to truth and spirit. If the quality of the things we take are poor, then the quality of what we give is poor. We submit to bullshit, and then we try to dominate, but in our attempt to dominate, we drag our bullshit into the new world we are trying to shape.

It's like a father who has a pure, baby boy. The father submits to the values of materialism, and then in his attempt to the "shape" the mind of his child, by dominating (all fathers must dominate), he pollutes his child with the stuff he submitted to. How you submit dictates how you dominate.

In life, when our taking and our giving (is there a difference between taking and giving? I think not) leads to unexpected negative surprises that harm us, we should feel responsible for understanding the unexpected chaos, especially if our intention was to create greater order and positive expectations.

Criticism of submission is an essential tool for ascension. The degree to which you criticize, is the degree to which you ascend. The degree to which you don't is the degree to which your psychology remains as it is - not valuable to your peers. Being not-valuable to your peers means you are limited to your own ego, rather than finding unity and cooperation with other individuals.

Ultimately, we are all motivated to contribute to order (be a father) and gain a mastery over the chaos (the mother).

Disorder thrives around individuals who esteem themselves prematurely. This is why the culture of self-esteem is so evil. There is truth-esteem or self-esteem. The former is virtue, the later is vice. The former is difficult, the later is easy.

Men who rely on self esteem invoke no feelings of gratitude and hope in their more truthful peers. Such false individuals cause resentment and ill will. But every moment is a chance to turn it around. One can be more careful to speak only about what one truly knows, rather than guessing or wishing. One can remove oneself from ideals and environments that are too challenging, removing oneself as a distraction, out of respect for those who are suited for the job. Likewise, one can remove oneself from poor-ideals and environments that are destructive to truth, removing oneself as a contributor to evil, out of respect for those who need you sharp and responsible.

The reluctance to be conscious of mistakes is the reluctance to increase the likelihood of making mistakes. A man might admit to only making a dozen mistakes, but that's because he doesn't have very challenging ideals. The more challenging and harsh your ideals, the more you will fail. So the root of spiritual failure is protecting yourself from the pain of failure. A sense of failure is created by our perspective. Challenging perspectives make everything more difficult, but you emerge as a valuable man. Easy perspectives make everything easy, but you emerge as useless distraction, a charity case.

It's a bit like those mediocre people who accurately claim to not be hypocrites. Well yeah, but your values are easy to live. It's easy to not be a hypocrite when all you have to do is be nice and tolerate most things. If your ideals are very challenging, then you'll end up a hypocrite all the time, but as long as you progress, you're going places that those who have it easy will never see.

Those who cannot bear pain, cannot ascend.

Finally, like I said, I am not directing this at anyone in particular. However, I am being submissive to something and I am dominating.

I am dominating any false person who openly reads this.

If a dozen false people read this with an open mind, then I just hit a dozen birds with one stone.
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Re: Mistakes

Post by Elizabeth Isabelle »

Ryan Rudolph wrote: Facebook could be transformed to be of higher quality, it has potential, and if so, I could remove a lot of work contacts and family so that I do not to have to bother to explain some of the harsh philosophy to. I really don’t see the point, as these people have no interest in philosophy, and would only use the information against me to cause unnecessary hardship in my life. I am not ready to martyr myself to truth in this manner. Call it vice, call it vanity, call it self-preservation, but that is ‘what is’. Basically, to the degree that you desire to adapt to a corrupt society, it will create the same degree of corruption within you. it is a law, I see it, I recognize it, and I know its there.
I'm not sure that removing work contacts and family would make it of higher quality - though I did just remove someone I barely knew because she had joined an app called "Holy Town" (I figured she was hopeless at that point). Many people on my Facebook "friends" list probably just look blankly at much of what I post before ignoring it, if they see it at all. Nevertheless, spreading awareness (however slight) to the unaware is even more important than spreading awareness to the already basically aware. So some social niceties also go into the mix - so what?

And what hardship can they add by what you post, so long as you are posting truth? Employers will still find harsher truths that get posted anywhere, even if you do not "friend" them. Giving people something to think about could be a good thing without having to fully martyr yourself to Truth. And just like why we post our real names here, on should decide how fully one believes and believes in something before posting it at all... though I can see where implications interpreted from the normals might haunt someone (like with some of the stuff I've posted)... there is a level of exposing people to the truth without martyring yourself.
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Ryan Rudolph
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Re: Mistakes

Post by Ryan Rudolph »

Elizabeth,

The biggest problem I see with work contacts being exposed to ones truth-based philosophy is that if individuals who are your supervisors misinterpret or even somewhat comprehend what you say, they can quickly conclude that you are crazy, and if you offend them with truth-based values, then they will use any justification to either make life miserable for you at work, or they will push you out of the company under different reasons. Basically, the only way to fully live the truth if if you live in a barrel, or you live in a manner that your survival is not dependent on ignorant people. Not easy when modern survival is based on compromising to the flaws of others.

What I like about GF is that the members all are here for a similar reason even if people are on different levels of progress, but everyone is somewhat seeking truth. When I was talking about the poor audience on Cory's postings, it wasn't necessarily his audience in particular that I was attacking, but I was generalizing to the overall member base of facebook as a whole, which is pretty mediocre and content sharing with members the trivial details of their day.

In my couple of years on the site, Cory's presence was the most novelty I have ever seen. So the site is pretty tame at best, and I was only commenting that it maybe more effective to undermine facebook by creating a new site, but it really doesn't matter. whatever happens is going to happen.

although, that post you put up is very concerning Elizabeth, as it has illustrated that facebook data is now being bought and sold to large corporations and governments and used by HR departments to screen employees for signs of things such as neurosis, instability, aggressive personality, and all the rest of it. The problem is that the data is being judged subjectively by imperfect people who could essentially put a black mark on your record, and deem you unemployable. Crappy for anyone who has to work for a living to survive. I would rather a private company creates a higher quality site that does not sell all its data about members to corporations and governments around the world.
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Cory Duchesne
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Re: Mistakes

Post by Cory Duchesne »

My situation is unique to me, and what works for me shouldn't be patterned after. Each person has to respond to his unique relationships and ascend or descend in their unique way.

I'm currently living off savings from an old, well paying job, grants and student loans. I also have the security of knowing I have been permitted to go on disability for Schizotypal Disorder.

Ryan, I am certainly not pressuring you to do anything you're not comfortable with, your situation is not the same as mine, and frankly, I don't pretend to understand anybody's predicament. My hostility stemmed from what I thought was dishonest and distracting opinion, that I don't think you are entitled to express without negative consequence.

I have reason to believe that individual progress involves releasing emotional oppression and that there is no one-sized philosophy that you can smack someone over the head with. Each individual probably only has only a few to a dozen rather specific experiences of communication that will allow him to ascend, and when you meet someone, you have to make an effort to learn about that persons emotional needs before you go ahead trying to influence with philosophical solutions. The poisoning of the heart must happen methodically, deliberately, cautiously and intelligently, tailored for the individuals unique psychology, strengths, weaknesses, and emotional state.

My experience on facebook is quite a bit more complicated than trying to influence people in any linear sense. I'm not going to explain it any further than I have, but it's a character building experience that, I admit, could lead to some problems down the road. But those will likely be overcome and hence, make me stronger. I will say that, I do have ego preservation boundaries. I will not say anything that comes across as directly misogynistic, as that would not be productive to the handful of good relationships I have on there. You cannot control how people will interpret words, and I have good reason to believe that the Woman concept takes far too much argument and conflicts to make palatable to anyone. The word "Woman" covers up way too much information, and you have to feed people the details and deepen the heart before you swing for big generalizations and labels.

So far, on FB, I've only publicly emphasized the dangers of psychological submission and the virtues of anti-submissiveness. That's as anti-feminine as I've gone so far, and I'm not sure how much further I would go. Everyone knows what submission is, the reality of it. It's crystal clear and I will push for that on people, without any conflict.

Overall, FB really isn't that big of a deal, and we should probably move on. However, I know GF has those user profiles, which I was reluctant to belong to because I didn't like being tied to the wacky Island of GF. Trevor, Elizabeth, Dan, Kevin, David, and Mr. Hodges are on there. If user profiles and transparency are important to anyone, then I think that everyone who is serious about being transparent should just make clear, truthful facebook accounts and link them to GF and any other forums and sites they benefit from.
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Re: Mistakes

Post by Alexis Jacobi »

Cory wrote:I also have the security of knowing I have been permitted to go on disability for Schizotypal Disorder.
Damn, you Canucks got it GOOD. If we could do that down here we'd all be rolling in dough.
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Cory Duchesne
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Re: Mistakes

Post by Cory Duchesne »

Learning from the Mistakes of Others

Unfortunately, we are not all born equal. There will be some men born who (from clearer perception and sensible fears) will act minimally and efficiently, accumulating fewer mistakes. However, just because they don’t personally commit errors, does not mean they do not learn from both the mistakes of those around them and the errors of past figures.

It’s a rare individual who can learn from the mistakes of others, saving himself the trouble. Even rarer is the man who can look far back into history and learn about the errors of great thinkers and entire civilizations. From a very logical, but spiritual perspective, this reaching back in time and learning from the dead is called “learning from past lives”.

However, just because an individual acts minimally and hence makes minimal mistakes, does not mean he is learning. Such a man may fear existence, avoiding the challenge of stepping into the world and avoiding the responsibility of acting and acknowledging the existence of his own soul, and the souls of others.

Quality Mistakes

Mistakes will vary in quality. Adults do not make a big deal about the struggle to tie ones shoes or put a shoe on the right foot. As we get older, our goals should be more challenging, so it’s not enough to just learn from mistakes. When our desire has been sufficiently built, we have to put our selves and increasingly challenging situations, and the mistakes (and consequent knowledge, will increase in quality).
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Tomas
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Re: Mistakes

Post by Tomas »

Alexis Jacobi wrote:
Cory wrote:I also have the security of knowing I have been permitted to go on disability for Schizotypal Disorder.
Damn, you Canucks got it GOOD. If we could do that down here we'd all be rolling in dough.
Some of these folks at Genius are better suited to be at KIR .. seems everybody over there is on [fill in the blank] Disorder disability.
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Elizabeth Isabelle
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Re: Mistakes

Post by Elizabeth Isabelle »

Ryan Rudolph wrote: although, that post you put up is very concerning Elizabeth, as it has illustrated that facebook data is now being bought and sold to large corporations and governments and used by HR departments to screen employees for signs of things such as neurosis, instability, aggressive personality, and all the rest of it. The problem is that the data is being judged subjectively by imperfect people who could essentially put a black mark on your record, and deem you unemployable.
Bad enough "judged subjectively by imperfect people" (I'm sure that "legalize murder" thread would be a problem, even though Laird noted right after the opening post that I'm an advocate for world peace) - but worse if judged by a computer looking for keywords and combinations. Wikipedia's bot threw out one of my edits "thinking" that it was spam when I corrected the wording on an article to clarify that men can get raped too. Fortunately 2 humans noted it was not spam and one had filed a "not spam" report before I even got back there - but point being that one's chance of employability could be trashed by some bot.

But considering that bots are taking over enough jobs that there are never going to be enough jobs for all of the people again, it's probably just as well that more people are put on the roles of the unemployable - so long as the bots support the welfare of the now unemployable. Wasn't that the idea of robots in the first place? To make it so humans didn't have to do as much work? Of course there will be an extended uncomfortable period between humans doing most of the work and most work being automated (and humans being able to contribute their true talents and passions with only a reasonable workload and a comfortable amount of hours). During this uncomfortable period, more and more people are going to get plucked off the workforce one way or another.
Tomas wrote:Some of these folks at Genius are better suited to be at KIR .. seems everybody over there is on [fill in the blank] Disorder disability.
Not so. Philosophaster is certainly not on disability, and I expect that a number of others are not on disability either - though I have not taken a survey. 2 out of 3 admins on GF are on disability - so what's the difference?

Unless you are suggesting that GF has suddenly gone right-wing, follow-the-sheeple-conservative? In that case, yes, anyone with a truly thinking mind would be better suited to KIR. Most of the fluff has moved out, and KIR has gotten into a more serious philosophical groove (though Yuku "upgrades" have made it hard to get on the board at all lately).
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Ryan Rudolph
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Re: Mistakes

Post by Ryan Rudolph »

Being on disability has its merits, it creates a certain fearlessness, one doesn't have to worry about the consequences of ones actions as much because ones survival isn't dependent on a corrupt system of imperfect judgmental individuals.. However, I'm going to become a bit more fearless on facebook, within my own limits.
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Cory Duchesne
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Re: Mistakes

Post by Cory Duchesne »

Finally, the most important thing I think I could say about mistakes.

We Create and Deny Mistakes to Serve the Interest of Power

A mistake is something we invent or deny in order to gain or keep power. A man who is intent on increasing his individual power is going to sharpen his criticism, which means he's going to draw an increasing number of boundaries in as many areas as he can, because the more boundaries a man can intelligently draw, the more he is able to rise about the limitations of boundaries in general. To increase consciousness is to increase boundaries, for this increase in boundaries allows one to go beyond all boundaries.

A man who is intent on preserving what gives him comfort will limit his criticism and avoid certain areas of thought. He is going to draw more simplistic boundaries because he wishes to remain in marriage within certain limitations. To draw boundaries too fine, too numerous and complex would be irrelevant to his current state of consciousness.
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Re: Mistakes

Post by GodsDaughter1 »

Cory Duchesne wrote:The hardest part about learning from mistakes is actually acknowledging and understanding the mistakes. You can’t learn from a mistake if you don’t first see it. And it’s the seeing that hurts.

GodsDaughter says: "And it's the seeing that hurts" actually, Cory it's seeing the mistake that's beneficial not hurting, because than you can work at correcting the mistake.


It’s nothing to be proud of to be a full grown adult and boast of only making 2 mistakes in ones life. The more mistakes you learn from, the greater the soul. More mistakes, more knowledge. More failure, more success. A man who has learned from a 100 mistakes is greater than a man who has learned from only 2 mistakes.

GodsDaughter says: It's the man who learned anything at all from one mistake that is the greatest, because it is he who continues to make mistakes that count in life, because he progresses and grows by correcting the mistakes he makes be it one or many, and by the time ripe old age is upon him and death is near, he'll be close to perfection. The man who only makes two mistakes in his life, has denied himself from living, afraid to be his own person. I only made one real mistake in life as an adult, and that was abortion!

However, I’d rather be friends with a man who has learned from his mere 2 mistakes, than be friends with a guy who hasn’t learned anything from his 100.

GodsDaughter says: Now you're getting the right idea!

What prevents us from being good people (through acknowledging mistakes) is pride, a lack of shame, and a poverty of idealism.

GodsDaughter says: It's good to point out anyone's mistakes, you will be doing them justice!

Pride is often an obstacle. Shame is the fuel for ascension. Intuition, Idealism and knowledge = a compass, a target, and a map.

GodsDaughter says: I think Shame is only the obstacle if it is deliberate, I see no ascension from shame. I see ascension from anger. Intuition is a truth to be relied upon if sensible. Knowledge = that what is known.
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