Does Marijuana Alter Logic?

[mensa-maniac]

Does Marijuana Alter Logic?

It would seem that only smoking logical people could answer this question. Being a recipient of possessing logic and being a toker, I can say marijuana doesn't alter my logic, but it brings a high awareness to my thinking. My mind seems more aware than altered. My friend says I change, a change is an alteration. Of course, I change, everyone changes upon toking marijuana, but it doesn't seem to alter my logic. My logic is stable and continuiing, logic is not broken or altered, it is just that I am more aware to what I'm thinking about in the fleeting moments under the influence of marijuana.

Marijuana influences people to be highly aware of themselves, some people experience paranoia because they are faced with themselves face to face due to the effects of marijuana giving them the feeling of awareness of themselves. This is a scary feeling to some of these paranoid people who face themselves through toking. Many people find themselves through toking marijuana because of the awareness factors marijuana posesses.

Marijuana heightens ones awareness of their thoughts, thoughts become the focus point. Your thoughts become magnified-totally aware. So if your thoughts are on God, God becomes the focus point and more and more thoughts will present themselves in association to God. If your thoughts are on yourself, yourself will become magnified like you become self-centered and depending on how you feel before you smoke marijuana will determine the outcome of your journey with smoking pot. If you feel inferior/blue/jealous/miserable or down trodden in any way, and you smoke pot, your feelings will be magnified, you will feel worse unless you suddenly change your mood to good.

The more marijuana one smokes the higher the THC level is in their bodies, and the less high they will feel unless the marijuana is high grade.

Marijuana is used world-wide by most people because it is good and has beneficial properties. If it wasn't good the majority wouldn't partake in it. In some countries it is legal and children consume it. Does marijuana alter logic? I can say no while straight, and I can say no while under the influence. If marijuana altered my logic while under the influence the answers would be different. What you see here is a logical truth and a mind under the influence.

[Manatron]

Maybe this could be answered, base; two grounds; does it alter logic immanently on the short-term and transcendentally in the long-term ? The question then becomes: Does marihuana alter logic in its + h = this general context ? yes and no.

It depends and it depends and it depends; three times dependence captures the pen.
The pen is a function of brain, so the computer is a tool of reason. Use the computer as a brain, and marihuana can alter logic. But the thinker is the operator, and if the thinker is SOMA, then there is some kind of cyborg, intermingled with hardware. If the cyborg has a purpose, then it will print an algorithm on the long-term, and if it doesn't have a purpose, then the purpose is weed.

So basically it depends if it alters logic. If you smoke too much, then you alter yourself and if you smoke just enough, then it may produce equilibrium in external state on the long-term.

[mensa-maniac]

Maybe this could be answered, base; two grounds; does it alter logic immanently on the short-term and transcendentally in the long-term ? The question then becomes: Does marihuana alter logic in its general context ?

Mensa says: Good question, Thank you, I see what you are saying here, you bring to mind more thinking! I clearly see that Marihuana does alter my memory, but seemingly not my logic. My logic is my ability to think logically, which brings to mind the question is my thinking altered? If my thinking is altered, is it logical to assume my logic is altered too, is it absolute that my logic is affected while under the influence of Marihuana?

It depends and it depends and it depends; three times dependence captures the pen.
The pen is a function of brain, so the computer is a tool of reason. Use the computer as a brain, and marihuana can alter logic. But the thinker is the operator, and if the thinker is SOMA, then there is some kind of cyborg, intermingled with hardware. If the cyborg has a purpose, then it will print an algorithm on the long-term, and if it doesn't have a purpose, then the purpose is weed.

Mensa says: I don't understand, "Use the computer as a brain, and marihuana can alter logic."

Mensa says: Thank you for sharing your knowledge. I see the computor compiled up from the greatest of minds. It cannot be more than a human mind, it only has the data of the human mind programmed into it. The only logic coming from the computor would be the logic of a logical reasoning mind. What does SOMA mean?

So basically it depends if it alters logic. If you smoke too much, then you alter yourself and if you smoke just enough, then it may produce equilibrium in external state on the long-term.

Mensa says: Ok, I understand this part. It boils down to your question "Does marihuana alter logic in its general context" which is a great question!

[mensa-maniac]

Does Marihauna Alter Logic?

I see that logic could alter any mind be it straight or under the influence of marihuana, but I cannot see that marihuana could alter logic. Logic is continuiing unless injury occurs to damage the brain. Marihuana doesn't damage the brain, but does it alter logic is the question?

What do you say Dan?

[Dan Rowden]

It is now a known medical fact that prolonged, regular use of the wacky tabacky harms the brain. There is no longer any real dispute about this except in the minds of those who wish to push for its legalisation and make money from it. Occasional use and use for medicinal purposes is another matter entirely.

As for its effects on logic: that depends on how logical one is beforehand. If one's natural disposition is to be rational it will likely have no detrimental effects and may even open the mind up in some way. If, however, one is not ordinarily of a logical nature, that irrationality will almost certainly be increased by it, as it will with any psycho-active drug.

In short: stupid people should not take drugs. Sadly, stupid people are the most likely to do so by dint of that very stupidity. Such is the comic tragedy of human nature.

[mensa-maniac]

It is now a known medical fact that prolonged, regular use of the wacky tabacky harms the brain. There is no longer any real dispute about this except in the minds of those who wish to push for its legalisation and make money from it. Occasional use and use for medicinal purposes is another matter entirely.

Mensa says: So the use of marijuana should be done so with care and attention, absolutely!

As this being a known medical fact, then I would suspect legalization will never happen, just because of this very fact that it harms the brain. I don't like that idea at all, however I would like to know how it harms the brain after prolonged use, and I guess I'll have to research the answer. Thanks for that information.

As for its effects on logic: that depends on how logical one is beforehand. If one's natural disposition is to be rational it will likely have no detrimental effects and may even open the mind up in some way. If, however, one is not ordinarily of a logical nature, that irrationality will almost certainly be increased by it, as it will with any psycho-active drug.

Mensa asks: Why is the word drug considered to be bad when associated to marijuana?

In short: stupid people should not take drugs. Sadly, stupid people are the most likely to do so by dint of that very stupidity. Such is the comic tragedy of human nature.

Mensa says: Then most the world are stupid people including myself, so I'm not alone in my stupidity. Really it is only stupid to smoke marijuana to abundantly, it should be smoked in moderation. To much of anything will affect you in some way.

The police over here couldn't give a rat's arse, they won't bust anyone with a little personal weed on them or in their homes, because this is BC the place where the majority smokes pot in Canada. People smoke pot in their yards, many smoke right on the street, but it still is mostly hidden.

[Dan Rowden]

That may be true of yourself, depending on which part of what I said you're relating to.

[Ryan Rudolph]

Marijuana probably activates many different parts of the brain that do not normally activate together, and the end result in most people is what i would like to call imaginative nonsense.

And to stoned people having a conversation, it can seem very deep and profound to them, but to a logical outsider observing, their thoughts are quite twisted, aimless, and nonsensical.

Looking back, I remember conversations from high school including brainstorming on how to make bongs out of household items, trying to imagine infinity, shared dumbfounded amazement with something trivial such as patterns and shadows on a wall, if aliens exist, if aliens are watching us right now....and other absurdities....

not what I would consider enlighened thought, as Dan suggests.

[mensa-maniac]

Marijuana probably activates many different parts of the brain that do not normally activate together, and the end result in most people is what i would like to call imaginative nonsense.

And to stoned people having a conversation, it can seem very deep and profound to them, but to a logical outsider observing, their thoughts are quite twisted, aimless, and nonsensical.

Looking back, I remember conversations from high school including brainstorming on how to make bongs out of household items, trying to imagine infinity, shared dumbfounded amazement with something trivial such as patterns and shadows on a wall, if aliens exist, if aliens are watching us right now....and other absurdities....

not what I would consider enlighened thought, as Dan suggests.

Mensa says: And what is enlightenment to you Ryan? Would you even know what an enlightened thought was, you are genius and I respect you for that, but, you're not genius enough to detect an enlightened thought. What exactly bothers you about the topic Marihuana, that you would make that statement? For me to bring up the topic of marijuana apparently makes me look stupid as you both suggest, we all know I'm not stupid. I shouldn't have associated it to myself. It's those who don't dare to risk themselves that are stupid! And Dan I can't say anything to you because I asked for it.

[Ryan Rudolph]

Mensa-maniac,

Stupid is a tad strong of a word. I do not think you are stupid to start this thread, Questioning is part of wisdom, but sometimes, questioning implies a bit of naivety, a lack in awareness when it comes to this subject. All the scientific evidence confirms my experience, which is that for the most part, Marijuana does not promote rational thought, the evidence suggests the contrary. However, Marijuana may break down some conditioning and levels of the ego, which are necessary for deeper forms of logic, but drugs alone cannot bring one to the enlightened state, the doors of perception can be blown away, breaking apart the firm grip the ego has on the brain, but even so, a lot of reasoning, reflection and study is needed to become fully rational and conscious.

The best way I can describe what Marijuana does to the brain is imagine a puzzle that is not put together correctly, Marijuana causes the pieces to be jumbled around a bit, but only temporarily, but the fact remains after wards - the puzzle is still not put together correctly.

[mensa-maniac]

Mensa-maniac,

Stupid is a tad strong of a word. I do not think you are stupid to start this thread, Questioning is part of wisdom, but sometimes, questioning implies a bit of naivety, a lack in awareness when it comes to this subject. All the scientific evidence confirms my experience, which is that for the most part, Marijuana does not promote rational thought, the evidence suggests the contrary. However, Marijuana may break down some conditioning and levels of the ego, which are necessary for deeper forms of logic, but drugs alone cannot bring one to the enlightened state, the doors of perception can be blown away, breaking apart the firm grip the ego has on the brain, but even so, a lot of reasoning, reflection and study is needed to become fully rational and conscious.

Mensa says: "Marijuana does not promote rational thought, the evidence suggests the contrary" I disagree that Marijuana doesn't promote rational thought. Ok, if God is considered irrational thought then marijuana promotes irrational thought! I know Marijuana promotes thought period! I know from empirical knowledge that Marijuana not only promotes thought, but the thought is magnified.
From an outsider it sounds like the thought is ridiculous or whatever, however, the outsider cannot think the same way as the pot induced subject, because both worlds are alien to each other. But, give the outsider some marijuana and he to will soon be babbling the same thought if it's not forgotten that quick. So what it boils down to is we have comparable thoughts from a straight mind vs. an altered mind.
You are saying thoughts from the altered mind are irrational, that's probably true considering most people are illogical before hand. But, the question here is, is logic altered? Is logic altered to the point of irrationality? Or is it just altered? Under the influence of marijuana, thoughts sound rational, but to a straight mind the same thoughts sound irrational. How can logic be altered if logic is a truth, how can it be altered? Altered in what way?
Thoughts from a straight mind are irrational even without marijuana.

The best way I can describe what Marijuana does to the brain is imagine a puzzle that is not put together correctly, Marijuana causes the pieces to be jumbled around a bit, but only temporarily, but the fact remains after wards - the puzzle is still not put together correctly.

Mensa says: Good description Ryan!

[Steven Coyle]

carabons plup

[mensa-maniac]

Does Marijuana Alter Logic

So if marijuana alters thinking, and thinking is thought, and thought is or is not logical, it is affected regardless of reasoning ability, reasoning ability just seems to revert to irrationality of thought under the influence of marijuana.

Ques: If logical thought can be altered, what would it be altered to?

Ans: It is altered to reduction, rational thought is reduced to irrational thought, it becomes it's opposite.

If above is true, then, rational thought becomes irrational thought...

Upon proving this I shall answer a question presented to me from two different mindsets--a straight mind vs. a stoned mind. This will provide evidence of rational or irrational mindsets. If indeed there is any irrationality there at all.

So throw a question at me.

[Steven Coyle]

mensa is a puzzle

[Manatron]

Marijuana probably activates many different parts of the brain that do not normally activate together, and the end result in most people is what i would like to call imaginative nonsense.

A simple model that describes the brain as a totality; there is the right hemisphere and the left hemisphere. Marihuana plays on the right hemisphere. This is an old an outdated model; at least this seems to me as it could be. If left is logic and right is imagination, then an overstimulation of the right sphere produces what you call imaginative nonsense because there is no synchronization between the two spheres and because of overload (but in science there is no such thing as nonsense). If however, this synchronization is established, then there could be innovation if thoughts are expressed in a formal way through intuition. Me myself does not believe that THC synchronizes the spheres and evidence supports the right sphere influent. It only re-inforces the imagination and the whole right thing. This remains nonsense, but if you define nonsense; non-sense as pertaining to dynamical field activity bypassing the five senses, then non-sense has sense simply because there is awareness of non-sensical phenomena; in which analytic observation is possible. If mental (self)analysis is possible, then it could be a matter of time before these programs are fully and adequately expressed.

Looking back, I remember conversations from high school including brainstorming on how to make bongs out of household items, trying to imagine infinity, shared dumbfounded amazement with something trivial such as patterns and shadows on a wall, if aliens exist, if aliens are watching us right now....and other absurdities....

Often it is the motivation at the starting point; which defines the rest of the experience. Shamans on the other hand; mostly they have a special purpose. Journeying down the spirit, summoning healing forces and all the things you probably are not attracted to. I think that you are basing your interpretations; viewing the youth in action. If you are not attracted to these "ethereal" fields, then there cannot be; any propensity towards differentiation processes and this effect could be the same as the effect; marihuana produces. If one interprets aliens and flying saucers as an absurdity, then this person is high because there is an expression in; non-participation --> research; could provide answers after differentiation and re-integration. Everything can be subject to research...even aliens and paranormal phenomena. If paranormal activity is interpreted as a function of mysticism, then demystification is an effect of research. "Paranormal" is a poor term. One could call this field; advanced memetics, but prefixing "memetics" cannot be done, because it is a paranormal proto-science; still a unity. Marihuana alters logic in the sense that it alters brain chemistry. It alters no description, because a description of processes is constructed with a left hemisphere functioning. These models are poor descriptions as a function of slow understanding. If the spheres are synchronized, and one is high, then there is; a better description possible or even a new one. This new one is then synchronized as some compatible block of logic, not nonsense as you understand it because if it would be nonsense, then this new block of logic is not an addition to existing models.
Of course there are also pure psycho-active drugs as dangerous agents. Marihuana is partially psycho-active. Its properties are more narcotic than psycho-active. It basically comes to this; if one is knowledgable as in having some glossaries printed in memory, then marihuana blocks beta waves if the substance is injected_(:term not medical) |and betawaves|<(which were necessary in "scanning" or commiting data to memory)_and the flow of intuition is coherent. Beta waves are not positive; if it comes to invention but they are positive in linear thinking and absorbing data. This absorption is not only dependent on beta, because this wave can be modulated on theta or gamma resulting in different bandwidths.

Today, non-sense phenomena are a very active field of research. You would be surprised if you knew how much science there exists. We don't see much of it because of some kind of economic constipation, which is also partially related to marihuana. In the USA; marihuana is prohibited like everywhere else, except in the Netherlands.

[Ryan Rudolph]

I suppose I do not see much value in altered states of consciousness caused by drugs. If one is logical, then that is all one needs. Chasing altered states only leads to an addiction to altered experiences.

If the right hemisphere and the left hemisphere are working harmoniously together, and one is able to think rationally and logically, I see no reason to throw drugs into the mix. The truth be told - most individuals who experiment with drugs may start off with sincere intentions, and a desire for something higher, but such repeated exposure leads to nothing but egotistical self- indulgence, and brain damage. Much of these drugs are not without their negative effects so prolonged exposure can actually do more harm then good.

psychedelic drugs have their place in the beginning, but as one matures, one also loses the motivation for needing such experiences.

[mensa-maniac]

Marijuana probably activates many different parts of the brain that do not normally activate together, and the end result in most people is what i would like to call imaginative nonsense.

A simple model that describes the brain as a totality; there is the right hemisphere and the left hemisphere. Marihuana plays on the right hemisphere. This is an old an outdated model; at least this seems to me as it could be. If left is logic and right is imagination, then an overstimulation of the right sphere produces what you call imaginative nonsense because there is no synchronization between the two spheres and because of overload (but in science there is no such thing as nonsense). If however, this synchronization is established, then there could be innovation if thoughts are expressed in a formal way through intuition. Me myself does not believe that THC synchronizes the spheres and evidence supports the right sphere influent. It only re-inforces the imagination and the whole right thing. This remains nonsense, but if you define nonsense; non-sense as pertaining to dynamical field activity bypassing the five senses, then non-sense has sense simply because there is awareness of non-sensical phenomena; in which analytic observation is possible. If mental (self)analysis is possible, then it could be a matter of time before these programs are fully and adequately expressed.

Looking back, I remember conversations from high school including brainstorming on how to make bongs out of household items, trying to imagine infinity, shared dumbfounded amazement with something trivial such as patterns and shadows on a wall, if aliens exist, if aliens are watching us right now....and other absurdities....

Often it is the motivation at the starting point; which defines the rest of the experience. Shamans on the other hand; mostly they have a special purpose. Journeying down the spirit, summoning healing forces and all the things you probably are not attracted to. I think that you are basing your interpretations; viewing the youth in action. If you are not attracted to these "ethereal" fields, then there cannot be; any propensity towards differentiation processes and this effect could be the same as the effect; marihuana produces. If one interprets aliens and flying saucers as an absurdity, then this person is high because there is an expression in; non-participation --> research; could provide answers after differentiation and re-integration. Everything can be subject to research...even aliens and paranormal phenomena. If paranormal activity is interpreted as a function of mysticism, then demystification is an effect of research. "Paranormal" is a poor term. One could call this field; advanced memetics, but prefixing "memetics" cannot be done, because it is a paranormal proto-science; still a unity. Marihuana alters logic in the sense that it alters brain chemistry. It alters no description, because a description of processes is constructed with a left hemisphere functioning. These models are poor descriptions as a function of slow understanding. If the spheres are synchronized, and one is high, then there is; a better description possible or even a new one. This new one is then synchronized as some compatible block of logic, not nonsense as you understand it because if it would be nonsense, then this new block of logic is not an addition to existing models.
Of course there are also pure psycho-active drugs as dangerous agents. Marihuana is partially psycho-active. Its properties are more narcotic than psycho-active. It basically comes to this; if one is knowledgable as in having some glossaries printed in memory, then marihuana blocks beta waves if the substance is injected_(:term not medical) |and betawaves|<(which were necessary in "scanning" or commiting data to memory)_and the flow of intuition is coherent. Beta waves are not positive; if it comes to invention but they are positive in linear thinking and absorbing data. This absorption is not only dependent on beta, because this wave can be modulated on theta or gamma resulting in different bandwidths.

Today, non-sense phenomena are a very active field of research. You would be surprised if you knew how much science there exists. We don't see much of it because of some kind of economic constipation, which is also partially related to marihuana. In the USA; marihuana is prohibited like everywhere else, except in the Netherlands.

Mensa says: Thank you, "marijuana alters logic in the sense that it alters brain chemistry" Exactly, and having logic is nothing more than thought itself, the thinking is altered through the combination of chemicals correlating together to create halucinatory images which alters thought.

Mensa says: Marijuana also inhibits the natural human drive, like putting off important duties, so I wouldn't recommend young people to smoke marijuana on a regular basis, as it acts as a detriment, like an association to procrastination. It is not safe to drive while under the influence, which is why there'll be an apparatus out soon if it's not out now that will determine whether a driver is stoned or not.

[Blair]

The short answer is, Marijuana turns you into a deadbeat.

It has not one iota of positive value.

[Robert]

I think the term 'altered states of consciousness' isn't really all that well defined, I've never really understood what a non-altered state is. Arguably, if you're alive, your consciousness is constantly in a state of being altered in some way or other - which seems to me to be part of the basic function of consciousness. Besides death, or pre-birth, I don't know what the opposite means.

psychedelic drugs have their place in the beginning, but as one matures, one also loses the motivation for needing such experiences.

Yeah, psychotropics get boring pretty quickly. Once you get the perceived benefits from them, doing them once in a while as a sort of reminder is ok, but I don't see the point in actively seeking to relive past buzzes. That said, I haven't done any for a few years, so maybe I'm due...

[Ryan Rudolph]

Dejavu,

Most people who are afraid of their thoughts share this view.

Its not being afraid of ones thoughts, its about not relying on a vice to function, and being able to think clearly without any sort of crutch.

Propaganda.

No, it is fact. Most users who experiment regularly aren't very advanced thinkers. Terence Mckenna is one of the only exceptions I can think of, as he was able to maintain some level of advanced rationality, and be a steady user. But it was not necessary, and he did die of a brain tumor.

Most people are afraid to experience the feeling of eternity. What's the most 'altered' state you've experienced?

Eternity is not a feeling, it is an entire state of being, an entire mindset and way of thinking. That is the problem with psychdelics. One experiences something intense and pleasurable, and then comes to all sorts of illogical conclusions, and then one tries to repeat the experience over and over. I've experimented with mushrooms and marijuana when I was younger, and I can honestly say that studying philosophy, and discussing/debating with others accelerated my progress more so than the drugs.

Robert,

I think the term 'altered states of consciousness' isn't really all that well defined, I've never really understood what a non-altered state is. Arguably, if you're alive, your consciousness is constantly in a state of being altered in some way or other - which seems to me to be part of the basic function of consciousness. Besides death, or pre-birth, I don't know what the opposite means.

Here is how I think of it - The brain needs certain molecules to function. For instance: the neurons need a steady supply of oxygen, sugar, and so on. However, there are substances such as THC and other psychedelic compounds, and toxins that can alter the way the brain functions, and cause an altered state, meaning a type of perception that is not indicative to how the brain normally functions when it receives only what is required for survival.

However, my argument is that the brain has not evolved to be able to withstand a steady bombardment of these alien chemicals, so a long-term user will inevitably cause brain damage to themselves.

The best metaphor I can give is think of some young males who buy sports cars, but they are not content with how fast the car normally drives with typical gas, so they upgrade some of the engine parts, and they start using additives like nitrious oxide to alter the way the engine performs, and the car may go very fast, and they may get very excited by the experience, but they are destroying their engine in the process because it was not designed to handle a constant bombardment of nitrious oxide. The engine only runs safely on gas alone, just like your brain. The brain only needs oxygen, sugar and other organic nutrients found in food. Anything else is an indulgence usually done for egotistical reasons.

[mensa-maniac]

Ryan:

I suppose I do not see much value in altered states of consciousness caused by drugs.

Most people who are afraid of their thoughts share this view.

Mensa says: Why would people create thoughts they fear? Why do humans create their own fear? I believe we create our own thoughts, and if we don't then they come from elsewhere. Perhaps, GOD creates our thoughts for us, God is so brilliant of an energy light, that he wills humanity to multiply so that he has more to play with in that he creates every individuals thoughts.

Mensa says: I just smoked a doobie, a nice fatty, full of THC, and wrote that above. I just realized that my thoughts are more imaginary at this moment while high. I'm totally aware, more like my awareness is heightened. It's like thoughts are magnified and continuous. Since being a subject of daily smoke intake, my levels of THC are high, therefore, the high experienced is not one of great imagery, compared to a subject who only smokes once or twice a week or less.

If one is logical, then that is all one needs.

lol

Chasing altered states only leads to an addiction to altered experiences.

Mensa says: It is chasing altered states for a reason, that reason is to escape the old humdrum of reality for another reality. Like book readers read escape literature for that very reason. To bring us away from the immediate for temporary relief from the harsh realities of life.


Propaganda.

psychedelic drugs have their place in the beginning, but as one matures, one also loses the motivation for needing such experiences.

Mensa says: Correct!

Most people are afraid to experience the feeling of eternity. What's the most 'altered' state you've experienced?

Mensa says: "What's the most 'altered' state you've experienced" When the idea that man succeeded in creating fast growing monsters through hybrid that could not be destroyed very easily. They grew outer shells that were unpenetratable to gun shells, they died only through the gasing of them. They were hideos beasts that were all powerful, intelligent creatures that terrorized earth.

Mensa says: Peace came upon earth, no diseases, no hatred, no anger, no jeolousies, no filth and corruption, just pure logical angelic beings, existing in harmony with one another. It was paradise, everyone worked together. But, what an imagination, we're only human!

[Manatron]

If the right hemisphere and the left hemisphere are working harmoniously together, and one is able to think rationally and logically, I see no reason to throw drugs into the mix.

The ability to think rationally and logically is usually attributed to the left hemisphere, so if the right hemisphere is patched through, then there are different modules in the right sphere; these are sustaining rational thought or they could block it to a certain extent. Ratio can be modulated by high emotional frequencies. The intensity of an emotion is quantitative, but quality is being transmitted on the carrier. In this way, there would be much less dependence on externally coded information. Or; Subjectivity is invoked and ideas are evoked or projected outwardly. Now, if the emotion as some vehicle is very intense, then some modules are accessed in the right sphere. These modules are not fully understood today. Drugs simply speeds up certain processes and is not positive if and only if one considers them as cognition improvers. But what is positive ? What does it mean ? Purpose. If you want to be a great painter, then you start as a beginner using 101 techniques. Later...you will see the world through your own eyes as a painter. You don't like the world...and then you smoke a joint....you start drinking....and at certain moments you find yourself as more creative...and so on. If you want to be become a mathematician, then you can either start at the top or bottom. If you start at the top, then you are at the level of the advanced depressed painter; quantified by sufferions = suf_ferions = fus_ferions = fus.ion_fer(m) = fusion OF ferm+ions in copy-paradox superstring fermions or parameters to set a rate for suffering; and so the level has genetic parameters. You go down...and a piece of your own nervous system is expressed but time goes backwards. At a later date, a painter picks up the geometry of the world...and the cycle continues. If the mathematicians start from the bottom, then the left hemisphere is active and the process is described slowly because there is more dependence. Advanced engineers for example...need objective data as drugs because left and right are usually harmonized so in the end there is always purpose. This data causes orgasms inside the whole body if the engineer has cultivated genius by means of advanced mental curve fitting. External resolution is probed by the mind. Information is exchanged. Advanced engineers are rational. Devotion is born.

[Ryan Rudolph]

Dejevu,

Like life you mean? We live once only.

A very mundane view. you know, trooper has a song called were are here for a good time, not a long time, but I wouldn't call such an attitude, a well thought out philosophy. It usually involves a justification for treating the body like a sewage disposal tank. But then again, It is the status quo, or in other words: the animal consensus.

The buddha once said, the body is a temple, treat it as such, but by temple, he didn't mean a garbage pile.

[mensa-maniac]

The short answer is, Marijuana turns you into a deadbeat.

Mensa says: That's easy for a non-smoker to say, I know people who've smoked for several decades and are seemingly fine.

It has not one iota of positive value.

Mensa says: I beg to differ that marijuana hasn't one iota of positive value, that simply is false, for the very fact that it is extremely enjoyable, now that's positive on it's own, and if that weren't true, smokers wouldn't partake in it a second time. Also, it provides positive sleep benefits. So princess, try not to have a temper tantrum.

[Animus]

I generally have to agree with Dan's first reply.

I've used marijuana for 14 years and I'm just about to smoke another joint. Averaging about 3 joints an evening, one every 2 hours, and that's pacing myself. I've learned to draw out the intervals between consumption, but its been difficult.

The way I see it, and this is a mix of experience and study... the initial use of marijuana alters perception in profound but elusive ways. Its not easy to place exactly what changes in perception. I think perhaps the best way of expressing it is short-term memory loss and inability to stay focused or loss of attention. However, in my experience the loss of attention and memory tends to pertain to attachment to external reality. I've been more apt to recede in thought, in a kind of meditative trance. Although marijuana is certainly not necessary for this purpose and not worth the damage to memory and attention. Let alone the habitual aspect.

The way I see the habit forming neurophysiologically is with the theory of compensation. Essentially what Ryan said about THC interacting with existing receptors. Think of it this way, somewhere in the brain there is a neurochemical similar to THC, it is similar primarily in its shape, the shape is what allows it to bind with the receptors, just like putting pieces of a puzzle together. The brain is modulating the production of this chemical along with myriad other chemicals using messenger molecules to normalize the function of the overall system. When THC or another drug is consumed it floods the area with its chemical and binds to receptor sites that it fits into, that its shape is compatible with. This occurs in addition to the regulated production of the existing chemicals. This causes over-activation and consequently abnormal operation of the system. The system compensates for this by down modulating the production or receptivity of the neurochemical that is being taken over by the drug. This is why prolonged use has so many negative effects on the system, the system becomes dependent on the drug for normal operation. The brain is very good at adapting to circumstances and it anticipates the influx of drug chemicals. A regular user like myself who smokes a joint every 2 hours will develop a compensation prior to and in anticipation of the next hit. What this means is that the brain anticipates the next joint and prepares itself by down regulating its normal operation. This is why users feel withdrawal effects, the brain is anticipating or craving the drug to return to normal operation.

The compensation theory explains much of drug addiction, it explains why alcoholics can die from cardiac arrest when trying to quit cold turkey. In that case alcohol takes over features of the cerebellum that regulate heart-rate. Enslaving the alcoholic to the alcohol in such a way as to literally kill them if they don't submit, and otherwise are plagued by withdrawal. There is something to be appreciated in a normal state of consciousness prior to the scourge of drug addiction. However, I don't think that the dynamics expressed in the compensation theory of drug addiction are very much different from the way us humans habituate to our environments in general.

I certainly don't recommend doing drugs, neither as a long-term user or someone a little keen on the theory.