Thoughts as they come

[skipair]

1. What's the deal with all the 1st world countries, especially the ones with the "highest quality of life" ratings, being very feminist countries?

2. In reasoning about reality, NEVER give someone the benefit of the doubt, never NOT give someone benefit of the doubt. Figure it out yourself.

3. An EX once said to me, "people don't htink you respect them." At the time I was horrified, but now I see that it is true. I find very little reason to "respect" most people. I think it is good for the world not to "disrespect" people, as in being an abusive asshole. Instead I think it's good to use clear reasoning with them, even if it hurts them, and explain how you do not respect A,B,C while you do respect X,Y,Z. They might feel disrespected here because they are A,B,C, but in my world explaining this is showing the highest respect.

There is nothing more disrespectful than lying to someone's face (and thus to yourself) to keep conflict at bay, or to grope for approval, or to escape fear of tension. Do you need people around you to be happy for you to be happy?

4. Knowing exactly who you are means always acting in accordance with you beliefs. Do you remember your beliefs given any situation? Can you act in the moment just as you would in retrospect with a clear mind? And if not, can you forgive yourself, and move on?

5. Women are talent scouts, and although their criteria selects very poorly the vast majority of the time (if you like being reasonable), they are also good for putting your ego through trials. Women sniff out insecurities in men like it's their job (it is). Can you put yourself in the fire and draw out your insecurities, and perhaps try using a woman as aid?

You can find your pride and shame this way. Does it make sense to have either?

6. When you are tired of practicing for life and it's time to take a break and DO life, you cannot "try" and you cannot plan. For logical thinkers (of at least for me) it's sometimes easy to forget about the feelings in our body. The analysis of our abstractions should not have us forget that we respond automatically, innately, and unconsciously to our environment as it unfolds before us. What we feel cannot be blocked or changed as it is what is already happening. The feeling needs to be accepted. What is that line in the Tao Te Ching about the Universe: if you try to change it, you will ruin it. Accept, and drop into flow.

[Blair]

1. What's the deal with all the 1st world countries, especially the ones with the "highest quality of life" ratings, being very feminist countries?

Technology diminishes the requirements of a society for brute male strength.

The men are castrated of their masculinity, consequently spending that festering energy in gyms, having their nails pedicured, chasing tail, etc.

[Nick]

What's the deal with all the 1st world countries, especially the ones with the "highest quality of life" ratings, being very feminist countries?

Western culture is less idealistic, and since most of the time the ideals humans try to live up to are complete bullshit, it might actually be helping them get along better without having any.

There is nothing more disrespectful than lying to someone's face (and thus to yourself) to keep conflict at bay, or to grope for approval, or to escape fear of tension. Do you need people around you to be happy for you to be happy?

Sometimes conflict is futile, at best you wont get anywhere, at worst you might end up getting yourself killed. Think of it this way, is it worth wasting your time arguing with someone to no avail or getting yourself killed over trying to explain the truth to one person with no potential, when you could instead spend your entire life intelligently picking out who to discuss truth with? In my opinion the latter choice is going to be much more fruitful.

Not saying you have to agree with people's bullshit, but sometimes it's better just to remain silent and nod. You just have to recognize people's limitations.

Women are talent scouts, and although their criteria selects very poorly the vast majority of the time (if you like being reasonable), they are also good for putting your ego through trials. Women sniff out insecurities in men like it's their job (it is). Can you put yourself in the fire and draw out your insecurities, and perhaps try using a woman as aid?

It can be fun listening to people point out my "flaws", but it gets redundant after a while. It usually boils down to "you suck at life" or more specifically, " you suck at doing the things I value most in life".

You can find your pride and shame this way. Does it make sense to have either?

It might make sense given the circumstances to feel prideful or shameful, but it's still delusional.

[Blair]

4. Knowing exactly who you are means always acting in accordance with you beliefs. Do you remember your beliefs given any situation? Can you act in the moment just as you would in retrospect with a clear mind? And if not, can you forgive yourself, and move on?

These types of situations don't arise in an enlightened person. He always acts in accordance with what he knows is right, there is no remembering, no compromise, no forgiveness, no remorse.

[volta]

There is nothing more disrespectful than lying to someone's face (and thus to yourself) to keep conflict at bay, or to grope for approval, or to escape fear of tension. Do you need people around you to be happy for you to be happy?

Sometimes conflict is futile, at best you wont get anywhere, at worst you might end up getting yourself killed. Think of it this way, is it worth wasting your time arguing with someone to no avail or getting yourself killed over trying to explain the truth to one person with no potential, when you could instead spend your entire life intelligently picking out who to discuss truth with? In my opinion the latter choice is going to be much more fruitful.

Not saying you have to agree with people's bullshit, but sometimes it's better just to remain silent and nod. You just have to recognize people's limitations.

I like that comment Nick as I struggle a lot with this; flip-flopping back between the two choices of defending truths or abandoning them. I had settled on abandoning them (after a whole lot of conflict) until I read some work by Ayn Rand where she effectively revived my long-held assumption that the world would be an even shittier place if people didn't stand up to defend critically valid principles and values. But as you point out, there is no point with some people as they are incapable of understanding them. (... I ain't gonna preach racial tolerance at the KKK convention any more!). So the logical follow-up is how can we distinguish between those who have the intelligence to be enlightened and those who don't? I guess it's a case by case judgment call, but I've found it to be a losing proposition more often than not.

[Robert]

There is nothing more disrespectful than lying to someone's face (and thus to yourself) to keep conflict at bay, or to grope for approval, or to escape fear of tension. Do you need people around you to be happy for you to be happy?

I have an elder brother who is a born again Xian, of the creationist, young earth, Darwin led to Hitler variety. He and his wife are happy in their delusionary existence, and whenever I'm around them and when talk turns to more essentiel matters, tensions arise very quickly. I have to lie to my own brother's face just to keep up the pretence of respect I barely feel for him. There's no point getting into a conflict with them, they have that conversation-stopper of faith in the bibical god. He has actually told me I'm going to hell if I don't repent my sins... What do you say to that? Laugh, cry or punch him in his fucking face?

[Trevor Salyzyn]

Robert, if you adopt a ridiculous position, and adopt a sincere tone of voice and demeanor, you'd be surprised at how quickly you can get someone to argue in defense of your real views. If your brother is clever, he's doing that. If he's not that clever, do it to him.

[Shahrazad]

Robert,

I have to lie to my own brother's face just to keep up the pretence of respect I barely feel for him.

I'd bet he doesn't respect you either, since you're not a born-again Xian.

He has actually told me I'm going to hell if I don't repent my sins... What do you say to that? Laugh, cry or punch him in his fucking face?

I'd say "If it's all the same to you, I'd rather not talk religion with you."

[Robert]

Robert, if you adopt a ridiculous position, and adopt a sincere tone of voice and demeanor, you'd be surprised at how quickly you can get someone to argue in defense of your real views. If your brother is clever, he's doing that. If he's not that clever, do it to him.

I doubt I'm a good enough actor to pull that off, and neither is he. That's a good idea though, I might give it some practice.

Robert,

I have to lie to my own brother's face just to keep up the pretence of respect I barely feel for him.

I'd bet he doesn't respect you either, since you're not a born-again Xian.

That's actually quite true, although it's difficult to know really when it's family, the emotional dynamic is more tying.

He has actually told me I'm going to hell if I don't repent my sins... What do you say to that? Laugh, cry or punch him in his fucking face?

I'd say "If it's all the same to you, I'd rather not talk religion with you."

Yeah, well my problem is I actually like talking about religion when I'm in the right mood, in his company. I just need to detach more.

[Carl G]

Are you the same Robert that used to post under various nom de plumes such as Descartes Horse?

If so, welcome back!

[Philosophaster]

1. What's the deal with all the 1st world countries, especially the ones with the "highest quality of life" ratings, being very feminist countries?

Higher technology makes child labor unnecessary. This means that it's no longer profitable in economic terms to have kids -- in fact it often puts people into debt -- so people have fewer of them. In addition, people have access to contraception. Since women in the developed countries are no longer pregnant or nursing or tending to kids all the time, they have time to work outside the home, so they demand the opportunity to do so alongside men -- which is feminism.

[Robert]

Are you the same Robert that used to post under various nom de plumes such as Descartes Horse?

If so, welcome back!

No.

Does the welcome still count? :)

[Unidian]

Hey Philo,

Odd, I was just wondering if you'd been posting anywhere and I had an inclination to come here. Didn't expect to see you, but there you were in the first topic I opened.

Anyway, I have nothing to add on the topic, just wanted to note the "synchronicity."

[DHodges]

I'd say "If it's all the same to you, I'd rather not talk religion with you."

I do not discuss religion with my family.

For a long time I had very little contact with my family. But hey, they are my family, after all, and that's something that I feel deserves some respect on its own, even if we do differ on some very fundamental issues.

4. Knowing exactly who you are means always acting in accordance with you beliefs. Do you remember your beliefs given any situation? Can you act in the moment just as you would in retrospect with a clear mind? And if not, can you forgive yourself, and move on?

I just started reading a biography of Gerrit Smith, after attending a speech given by the author. He is a very inspiring character in this respect. Other people from the Abolition movement, such as John Brown, are fantastic examples of acting on what you believe, even when the personal cost is very high.

[skipair]

I have to lie to my own brother's face just to keep up the pretence of respect I barely feel for him. There's no point getting into a conflict with them, they have that conversation-stopper of faith in the bibical god. He has actually told me I'm going to hell if I don't repent my sins... What do you say to that? Laugh, cry or punch him in his fucking face?

In a way I think it's possible to treat people the same, whether you "respect" them or not.

Respect as I see it isn't an emotional issue, just a recognition of shared values.

Ideally, a behavioral base of clear reasoning is still the foundation no matter what thoughts, situations or people pass by. So I see no pretense to maintain unless there's still a desire to pamper an emotional attachment.

If natually compelled, I still see value, within reason and time permitting, for getting into conflict with someone of silly values regardless of likelyhood of success. It still sends out good ripples. Honestly I don't know if the punch to the face tech would work. I'll try it out and report back.

[Philosophaster]

Hey Philo,

Odd, I was just wondering if you'd been posting anywhere and I had an inclination to come here. Didn't expect to see you, but there you were in the first topic I opened.

Anyway, I have nothing to add on the topic, just wanted to note the "synchronicity."

Cool. :-)

[MindExpansion123]

What is respect? It's the acknowledgement of another fellow human being. Ex. he's like me, though we are different - eats food, shits, works, has plans, family, etc (etc, etc, etc).

Disrespect: viewing another human being as lower than you are.

Note: perhaps I dislike people that do that (disrespect others) because I feel inferior and it's just my way of insulating my ego and protecting myself from harm or discomfort.

[Nick]

What is respect? It's the acknowledgement of another fellow human being. Ex. he's like me, though we are different - eats food, shits, works, has plans, family, etc (etc, etc, etc).

Disrespect: viewing another human being as lower than you are.

Note: perhaps I dislike people that do that (disrespect others) because I feel inferior and it's just my way of insulating my ego and protecting myself from harm or discomfort.

Most people are largely unconscious, so I don't waste my time trying to speak the truth to them, i.e. I disrespect them. If I discuss truth with you, it's because I do have respect for you.

So if I'm ever listening to someone talk about their family, work, love life, and all the other worldly things people fill their time with, and you see me politely nodding along tossing in a few simple pleasantries you can be sure I have no respect for that person. I.E. when I'm behaving respectfully by most people's standards, I'm actually being disrespectful by my standards.

[MindExpansion123]

If someone thought that you were being disrespectful by telling that person to "shove it," then they'd be right.

Most people are largely unconscious, so I don't waste my time trying to speak the truth to them

They don't respond to you and therefore they're unconscious? Take this as an example: if someone has a family and you don't, then obviously some of they're thoughts will be about they're family. Now, If you had a family, then the two of you would have something in common and you'd probably find such a conversion a little stimulating, but because you don't, it doesn't mean that they're unconscious. You see?

So if I'm ever listening to someone talk about their family, work, love life, and all the other worldly things people fill their time with, and you see me politely nodding along tossing in a few simple pleasantries you can be sure I have no respect for that person.

What's wrong with that and what do you mean by no respect? A form of respect might be this: treating another as you yourself would like to be treated. So, if you were in his shoes, would you like to be told to shove it? If so, then that may still be a sign of respect.

[MindExpansion123]

Yes, I see.

[Nick]

Skip,

M.E. is a great example of why I just don't bother with most people.

[MindExpansion123]

Again... I've been deleted, again! What gives, dudes?

Nick Treklis, is it due to your mis-comprehension of my posts? Basically, it's like this: you said that you have no respect for someone when they're talking about their family, love life, kids, etc, because they're putting their top priorities into the forefront of their lives - and therefore, having a discussion about it with someone who is disinterested and only pretending to be paying attention. Well, I think that it is very respectable that someone would put their family before all else. Obviously, such people would want to talk about it with someone who has a family of their own. It is very respectable. In that case, you should do the same and excuse yourself instead of pretending... Huh?

[Shahrazad]

ME, Nick does not have the power to delete your blogs or ban you. Only the QRS can do that.

[MindExpansion123]

Yeah, I thought so, though, I also can see why you though that I thought that Nick deleted or locked it.

Why are they picking on me? I'm sincere with my posts. SOo... Why me?

[MindExpansion123]

Gosh, people can be so judgmental at times!