How can women be sexually appealing...

[Shahrazad]

Animus,

For me, when it comes right down to crass tacks/brass facts most actresses and such like are ego-monsters with only an immediate appearance of attractivity.

Really? Even a hot thing like Linda Carter?

[David Quinn]

Without the male desire to conquer his ideation of woman, sex would become mundane and uninteresting - akin to relieving one's bladder in the toilet.

Heavenly bodily pleasure rising to an intense crescendo, sans any relation to women, would not be mundane and uninteresting.

A good piss can also produce a crescendo of heavenly bodily pleasure. It's still not all that interesting, though.

But I agree with you that women will probably lose out to technology in the pleasure department. Women won't be able to compete with what technology will offer in that regard. When it happens, it could have some interesting social consequences.

-

[Animus]

Animus,

For me, when it comes right down to crass tacks/brass facts most actresses and such like are ego-monsters with only an immediate appearance of attractivity.

Really? Even a hot thing like Linda Carter?

Who is Linda Carter?

I don't have cable or any such thing.

Er... I guess I can google her (I said Google)

No, probably not.

If I was going to go that route I'd probably go with something like this : http://www.enjoylifemagazineonline.com/ ... remier.jpg

Or here, this one looks nice http://www.myclassiclyrics.com/artist_b ... graphy.htm

[Shahrazad]

Animus,

Who is Linda Carter?

She is Wonder Woman. The most beautiful woman alive. On top of that, she's nice in real life.

[David Quinn]

If they have all that gunk all over them?

Bad Breath
Body Odor
Gunk in their eyes
Snot
Faeces inside them and on them
Stinking feet, dandruff
Disease and spore ridden gaping vagina hole
Wax in the ears
That stench, that rotting blood stink
and most of all, that presumptuousness.

Frankly...eewwh.

Lust is easy to overcome when you allow these aspects to have a place, focus on the entirety of the being.

Swim in the infinite.

There are schools of Buddhism which practice this kind of meditation - focusing on the mucus, puss, germs, blood, etc, that permeate a woman's body - as a way of trying to break her spell. I'm not sure it is all that effective as it keeps the mind focused on the physical aspects of woman, on her sexuality, which only plays into her hands. As Jason says, when lust is strong enough, all thoughts of mucus miraculously disappear and the images of female sexuality which have been burned more deeply into the mind via the meditation suddenly become a powerful force to deal with.

Psychologically, engaging in sex expresses a will to self-degradation and self-destruction. So rather than acting as a corrective or a cure, meditating on the mucus of women can actually have the reverse effect. It can enhance the lure of feminine sexuality. The self-degrading and self-destructive elements, which have been brought into greater focus via the meditation, can make the desire to lose oneself in sex even more tempting. Especially for men who try to be pure.

I've always found the best way to tackle the issue is by seeing into the paucity of women's minds and discerning how incredibly dull they are. Behind the razzle-dazzle of woman there is almost nothing going on. As such, wanting to have sex with a woman is like wanting to have sex with a person with Down Syndrome.

-

[Animus]

Animus,

Who is Linda Carter?

She is Wonder Woman. The most beautiful woman alive. On top of that, she's nice in real life.

Surely though, she isn't Genius?

I've known lots of hot and nice girls, but they were also dumb. And as soon as they pull that "If you don't treat me better I'm taking my pussy elsewhere" nonsense I bid them farewell. Usually by that time they are already fuckin someone else. Its not that I'm not respectful to them, its just that I won't submit myself to them and do the whole bed of roses, candlelight crap.

So... I haven't even bothered with women since July 2007.

[David Quinn]

Well, the way it is right now is all part of the thrill for me, ya know? Nothing hotter than the chase, the pent up sexual frustration trying to make it [you know, it] last, etc...

Indeed. As any experienced seducer will tell us, the chase is the main game and the biggest thrill of sex. The actual physical act at the end is almost an anti-climax, a ritual that has to be got through. The woman has already submitted, the game has already been won.

It will be interesting to see if technology can offer the same kind of thrill. I suppose it could one day - e.g. devising difficult games with exotic rewards for advanced users.

-

[Dan Rowden]

If technology replaces the human element, the same psychology will nevertheless be in evidence.

I certainly agree that technology can provide sexual gratification via simple physical stimuli. I don't think anyone has argued that sexual gratification has to involve actual women or involve the various complexities of the ideation of Woman. It's just that if it does involve an actual woman, either certain elements of that ideation, or basic dominance/submission dynamics will be in effect. The question there will simply be - to what extent is an actual women involved (rather than say a symbolic woman as one finds in porn).

[Dan Rowden]

As such, wanting to have sex with a woman is like wanting to have sex with a person with Down Syndrome.

That's gotta go down in the "Quinn's Quotable Quotes" annals.

[David Quinn]

If technology replaces the human element, the same psychology will nevertheless be in evidence.

I certainly agree that technology can provide sexual gratification via simple physical stimuli. I don't think anyone has argued that sexual gratification has to involve actual women or involve the various complexities of the ideation of Woman. It's just that if it does involve an actual woman, either certain elements of that ideation, or basic dominance/submission dynamics will be in effect. The question there will simply be - to what extent is an actual women involved (rather than say a symbolic woman as one finds in porn).

You could conceivably create a piece of sexual technology or a sexual game which is difficult for users to conquer, thus making the rewards it has to offer even more desirable - e.g. a particularly intense form of sexual pleasure. The resistence put up by the game would mirror the resistence put up by females; the qualities to succeed at the game would mirror the qualities needed to seduce a female. An aura about the game could emerge. It could develop a world-wide reputation of being difficult to beat, which would bestow the victor with an increase in social status.

This will be the challenge for women in the future. Being composed of imperfect technology themselves, they will have to compete with superior forms of technology. They may well lose out.

-

[Nick]

How do you explain homosexuals and bisexuals who still emerge from this hetero-centric society?

Molestation as a child by an older member of the same sex or over exposure to sexual stimuli as a child, and other forms of sexual abuse endured at a young age.

Yeah I think that all sounds reasonably plausible, but I also think it's possible that this could coexist with innate drives for heterosexual coupling in some form.

Innate drives for heterosexual coupling doesn't mean it's not projecting your on ideals on to whatever it is that you desire. I'll elaborate in my response to Carl here.

[Nick]

I did not get most of the programming you mention though I agree it exists and is persuasive.

Just because you weren't directly conditioned by the examples I provided doesn't mean you weren't indirectly conditioned by them and directly conditioned by others I didn't include. Because either way, one can't deny the fact that these memes permeate our society and culture and end up shaping our minds and lives from a young age one way or another.

However I was still primed, therefore I believe it is innate in us, in some of course more than in others.

Even if the object in which one directs their reproductive impulses at are what one might describe as innate, that doesn't mean it isn't a form of projection. The fact of the matter remains that women, or anything else for that matter do not inherently exist. Add to that the fact that women aren't much more than unconscious sacks of blood, bone, guts and feces and it's all too clear that when we become sexually aroused by women it is nothing more than our imaginations running away with us. Whether this is done half-consciously through ideation or unconsciously through some innate or genetic predisposition doesn't matter, because ultimately it is still our minds which are tricked by our delusions into believing there's something there which actually isn't. So the more in touch we are with the reality of the situation, the less likely we are to be tricked, and simple reproductive impulses are unlikely to motivate us enough to go chasing after whatever most resembles our ideal sexual counter-part. The mind is the ultimate filter.

[Dan Rowden]

If technology replaces the human element, the same psychology will nevertheless be in evidence.

I certainly agree that technology can provide sexual gratification via simple physical stimuli. I don't think anyone has argued that sexual gratification has to involve actual women or involve the various complexities of the ideation of Woman. It's just that if it does involve an actual woman, either certain elements of that ideation, or basic dominance/submission dynamics will be in effect. The question there will simply be - to what extent is an actual women involved (rather than say a symbolic woman as one finds in porn).

You could conceivably create a piece of sexual technology or a sexual game which is difficult for users to conquer, thus making the rewards it has to offer even more desirable - e.g. a particularly intense form of sexual pleasure. The resistence put up by the game would mirror the resistence put up by females; the qualities to succeed at the game would mirror the qualities needed to seduce a female.

That all makes sense, yet omits a vital part of the "game" - risk. How would such a game create the element of risk (rejection)? Yes, its characters might reject you, but it's just a game so I'm not sure how the risk would be experienced as significant compared to what one experiences with real women to whom one is greatly egotistically attached. I suppose a player might become attached to the game itself in that way, but it seems a bit of a stretch, unless we're talking about dumb people.

Actually, that last part might be redundant.

[Shahrazad]

David,

This will be the challenge for women in the future. Being composed of imperfect technology themselves, they will have to compete with superior forms of technology. They may well lose out.

You just don't get it, do you? Still think women have something to lose? Why would we need men when we have machines that perform much better than 90% of men? (See the machines Jason linked to.) It's men the ones who should be worried: they are becoming obsolete.

[Jason]

Well, how bout just looking into online personals. The penis to pussy ratio seeking casual sex seems very high, potentially driving up your stock and bargaining power massively! Plentyoffish.com

Jason, you have got to be kidding me. What gave you the impression that any man can do the job for me?

Nothing. I'm saying that there is such demand for casual pussy that you could probably be very picky in choosing the man for the job.

You seem to not get it at all. I'm not going to explain the details to you here, as it could be kinda tacky in an internet forum.

PM me then, I'm curious.

[Dan Rowden]

It's men the ones who should be worried: they are becoming obsolete.

If only it were true that men were becoming obsolete in that sense. They might just be forced into thinking yet!

[Shahrazad]

I'll pm you, Jason.

[Jason]

Anagram Server is a great link for killing time.

The concept of killing time depresses me. It seems so aimless and passionless. (Sorry, I don't mean to bring you down, I found those anagrams surprisingly amusing.)

[Dan Rowden]

What did time ever do to anybody, such that all we want to do is waste and kill it?

[Jason]

Time is hardly innocent, it's killed untold millions.

[rebecca702]

I've always found the best way to tackle the issue is by seeing into the paucity of women's minds and discerning how incredibly dull they are. Behind the razzle-dazzle of woman there is almost nothing going on. As such, wanting to have sex with a woman is like wanting to have sex with a person with Down Syndrome.

That was absolutely classic.

I think not only would it help to ponder how dull they are, but how alike they are (maybe that's pretty much the same thing). They don't seem to differ much in intelligence or ambitions - only very slightly in style.

Dan,

That all makes sense, yet omits a vital part of the "game" - risk. How would such a game create the element of risk (rejection)? Yes, its characters might reject you, but it's just a game so I'm not sure how the risk would be experienced as significant compared to what one experiences with real women to whom one is greatly egotistically attached.

Have you seen the movie Vanilla Sky? If you haven't, then I don't want to ruin it - but it's an example of how this might be achieved. Also, it is a great metaphor for the decision one must make between a happy dream playing "halflings" with a mate versus having courage to confront the truth.

[Animus]

PM me then, I'm curious.

You can know all the physical tricks in the world, but none of that stuff overcomes the mind of the woman.

fMRI studies show that when women are in the act they tend to worry, and that just before orgasm the worrisome part of their brain shuts off.

This may be the case for insecure people, but people who are secure in their "identity", it might be all about the physical stuffs. In which case you have g-spot, clitoral, slightly-varied rhythymicty, etc..

All the stuff you probably already know.


My ex-gf had no complaints what so ever about my technique, it was more-or-less the voices she heard outside, or the odd creek or pop of the woodwork.

[Dan Rowden]

That all makes sense, yet omits a vital part of the "game" - risk. How would such a game create the element of risk (rejection)? Yes, its characters might reject you, but it's just a game so I'm not sure how the risk would be experienced as significant compared to what one experiences with real women to whom one is greatly egotistically attached.

Have you seen the movie Vanilla Sky? If you haven't, then I don't want to ruin it - but it's an example of how this might be achieved. Also, it is a great metaphor for the decision one must make between a happy dream playing "halflings" with a mate versus having courage to confront the truth.

I've seen it, but have no real memory of it other than thinking it was passingly interesting. The problem with this sort of technology, if it were possible, is that it would just be replacing one set of delusions with another (or, really, placing the same set of delusions within a slightly different framework). So, I'm not sure how much I care that it's possible. Indeed, it might make things even worse.

[David Quinn]

That all makes sense, yet omits a vital part of the "game" - risk. How would such a game create the element of risk (rejection)? Yes, its characters might reject you, but it's just a game so I'm not sure how the risk would be experienced as significant compared to what one experiences with real women to whom one is greatly egotistically attached.

Have you seen the movie Vanilla Sky? If you haven't, then I don't want to ruin it - but it's an example of how this might be achieved. Also, it is a great metaphor for the decision one must make between a happy dream playing "halflings" with a mate versus having courage to confront the truth.

I've seen it, but have no real memory of it other than thinking it was passingly interesting. The problem with this sort of technology, if it were possible, is that it would just be replacing one set of delusions with another (or, really, placing the same set of delusions within a slightly different framework). So, I'm not sure how much I care that it's possible. Indeed, it might make things even worse.

You could switch them off at least.

-

[rebecca702]

I've seen it, but have no real memory of it other than thinking it was passingly interesting. The problem with this sort of technology, if it were possible, is that it would just be replacing one set of delusions with another (or, really, placing the same set of delusions within a slightly different framework). So, I'm not sure how much I care that it's possible. Indeed, it might make things even worse.

I think it definitely would make things worse. Didn't mean to sound as though I thought it would be progress in a healthy direction or anything.

I watched it again recently and saw the "making of" where they talked about how in the story the purpose of the virtual reality program was basically so that he could experience the externalization of his mind. And of course being loved by a woman was a big part of that. That really stuck with me, because the guy was obsessed with approval and had very little self-love. So his main motivation was to have love reflected back to him, and he chose to enter the virtual reality world with a wiped memory so he would not know it wasn't real. To him it was more important to feel "love" even though it wasn't real, than to deal with reality.

The movie was depressing as hell, but I think it made a deeper point that not a lot of people got - that it's actually like real life. When men enter relationships with women they are agreeing to forget the importance of reality - they opt to experience an externalization of their minds instead of turning their awareness inward toward their own mind.

I don't know if there's anything worth thinking about it all of that, but the general idea was that 99% of people want love. They might say they want truth, but they want love.