The Problem With Women Today

[Shahrazad]

Alex, go fuck yourself in the ass with a sand-paper-covered bat.

Panama is a place where a woman like Balbina Herrera, daughter of a domestic maid who worked for $80 a month, can rise to be a millionaire, and President of her country. Any man worth his salt would prefer to marry a Balbina than a Colombian beauty queen.

Oh and Alex, just for your info, there are 200 women in my family and not more than three of them are ugly. And my kid, who is getting As in college, is prettier than any Colombian beauty, and has a perfect body without ever having had breast or butt implants, or any other kind of work done. You are a big liar.

[Alex Jacob]

Relax, Shah. I know you sort of hate me and everything. The truth is that I was baiting you a little bit, and you took it to heart.

I only ask you to consider there must be a reason your men are turning gay in droves.

[Carl G]

The truth is that I was baiting you a little bit

Alex Jacob, master baiter.

[Shahrazad]

Alex,

Relax, Shah. I know you sort of hate me and everything.

I don't sort of hate you. I just don't let anybody talk like that about my women. You owe me an apology.

[Carl G]

Alex doesn't care. He cannot care. The pseudo-Latin master-baiter is caused to not care. About your feelings.

[Nick]

Yes, but men and women play vastly different roles in this competition.

Yes...and?

And what? We're discussing the role of the sexes. I'm not sure what you're getting out of this discussion but I don't think it has anything to do with what's actually going on here.

Actually I'm reasonably well-versed in economic, biological and evolutionary analysis of romantic/reproductive male/female relationships. The reality is I was trying to address the ongoing misogynistic undertones that seem to be present in a lot of these discussions on GF. You and Rhett were the main targets, although there is a general tone on this thread, and your first post that I responded to simply allowed me the easiest entry.

Oh, so this is what you're getting out of the discussion.

It's actually a victim mentality that I see, and then a corresponding attempt to bolster oneself by identifying with one's gender - "Us males built civilisation!" and so forth. Admittedly I may have misfired a bit in targeting you the way I did; I'm not sure you really fit this mold so much. But hey, I like your energy and feistiness.

I don't have a problem with you psycho-analyzing me and making assertions, have at it, but what pisses me off is when people get carried away with these things instead of dealing with the actual points being made. You end up just looking like a douche bag wannabe Dr. Phil, and I don't like Dr. Phil.

[Nick]

Nick, in my neck of the woods, there are six women for each eligible man. Men decide which of so many women are worthy of their attention. The women who don't get chosen make no decision at all. It is the man who starts the process.

This doesn't refute the fact that women play the role of gatekeeper when it comes to accepting or rejecting a man. He needs to win her approval. Without, he hasn't an ice cube's chance in hell with her. It amazes me how one can be so dishonest as to try and argue this. Ignorance is the only explanation, I suppose.

Like Jason said, you seem to have a need to see your whole gender as the victim of the other gender. That is why you ascribe the responsibility to women.

That's great Shah, but my statement above is a fact about the nature of the sexes, and neither you or Jason have come remotely close to refuting it.

Your way of looking at it is even simpler: that the competition applies to men and not to women.

Then you aren't paying attention because I never said, nor implied that. In fact it has nothing at all to do with anything I've said.

[Shahrazad]

Nick said,

Then you aren't paying attention because I never said, nor implied that. In fact it has nothing at all to do with anything I've said.

Then who does the competing, Nick? Can you restate that part?

[Alex Jacob]

Shah writes;

"I just don't let anybody talk like that about my women."

Sure, but have you paid attention to what you say about your men? If you can be 'truthful' about your men, can't I be truthful about your women?

"You owe me an apology".

You owe me $54,021.38 for the reconstructive surgery to my asshole.

Were all the 200 women in your family sired by Omar Torrijos?

Carl, why do you interpose your bleak self in my 'conversations'?

[Shahrazad]

Alex,

Sure, but have you paid attention to what you say about your men? If you can be 'truthful' about your men, can't I be truthful about your women?

You weren't being truthful, you were lying.

"You owe me an apology".

You owe me $54,021.38 for the reconstructive surgery to my asshole.

Oh, you finally took my advice? Colombian surgeons won't charge you $54k. Or were you talking about Colombian pesos? Cuz that would be about 23 dollars.

Were all the 200 women in your family sired by Omar Torrijos?

No, he only sired three women: Carmen, Raquelita and Tuira. But in case you haven't figured it out yet, the 200 women I mentioned are all closely related to OT, including my kids and me. We have very good genes. I think you got stuck with the wrong crowd when you lived in Panama. But don't take it out on me.

Before you ask, there are only two gay men in my very extensive family. We've had a sudden invasion of foreigners, especially Colombians. Perhaps that is where all the gays are coming from? It's certainly where all the extra crime is coming from.

[Dan Rowden]

What men value is Woman, in every sense that term entails. They seek a biological woman to embody this. Men sometimes choose a specific woman, but not always. They think they've done the choosing, but they don't recognise the subtle signals that a woman gives out when in reality she's chosen him.

However, a man never chooses his success with a specific woman. If she doesn't choose him, he's screwed no matter what he does.

It's hard to say what the rate is at which one sex does the actual choosing. It's hard to say in how many instances a man thinks he's chosen a woman when he's simply oblivious to the fact that she has lured him with sub-conscious behaviour.

[Carl G]

Carl, why do you interpose your bleak self in my 'conversations'?

Because my self isn't bleak, and these aren't your conversations?

I am starting to feel sorry for you, though, you've turned out to be such a putz (a surprisingly mean-hearted one, at that). So maybe I will back off.

[Carl G]

A young man is ripe for the picking (by a female choosing him) greatly because he has a plethora of idealisms confusing him about Her.

First, he is unconsciously looking for a mother, an extension of his mother and the home grew up in, or, if it was a poor home life, the mother he wished he had, to take care of him.

Second, he is unconsciously enamored of the girlishness in her, the girl grown up but still there and it triggers the pedophile in him, or maybe this is simply another extension of his immaturity, boy meets girl after puberty, he doesn't see her as a woman, or himself really as a man. A lot of men's addiction to woman's looks, and to ultra femininity (flowiness, emotionalism) can be traced to this. A lot of lust and sexual fantasy, as well.

The third idealism is more mature but no less delusional; it is his unconscious want of the goddess. The goddess is an idealized woman who is conscious, self-aware, self-confident, beautiful, life-bringing, life-affirming, and powerful, akin to the Earth and Nature. Unfortunately, few if any women actually embody this feminine potential. Some may appear to, but usually there is pretty ordinary behavior behind the facade, or more properly, behind the man's idealism.

By any or all of these forms of idealism, the man traps himself.

[Nick]

Nick said,

Then you aren't paying attention because I never said, nor implied that. In fact it has nothing at all to do with anything I've said.

Then who does the competing, Nick? Can you restate that part?

I was never talking about who does the competing, so there is not part on that to restate.

[Nick]

It's hard to say what the rate is at which one sex does the actual choosing. It's hard to say in how many instances a man thinks he's chosen a woman when he's simply oblivious to the fact that she has lured him with sub-conscious behaviour.

What matters most is that the man has accepted Woman as something of value. Any role as he plays in choosing at this point doesn't amount to anything more than that of a bidder at an auction where the woman is empowered and placed in a position to choose the highest of the bidders. In this scenario, the woman's ability to choose carries much more weight than a man's.

[Jason]

What matters most is that the man has accepted Woman as something of value.

The woman has also obviously accepted men as being something of value too. Why does the man's acceptance of women's value matter more than women's valuing of men?

Any role as he plays in choosing at this point doesn't amount to anything more than that of a bidder at an auction where the woman is empowered and placed in a position to choose the highest of the bidders.

Fat ugly women aren't likely to get many or high bids, maybe even none, thus showing that "he" has and makes many choices in his bidding and is "empowered" thereby.

[Nick]

What matters most is that the man has accepted Woman as something of value.

The woman has also obviously accepted men as being something of value too. Why does the man's acceptance of women's value matter more than women's valuing of men?

I'm talking about the philosophical ideal of Woman, something biological women, along with men, have also accepted. Women become it, men worship it.

Any role as he plays in choosing at this point doesn't amount to anything more than that of a bidder at an auction where the woman is empowered and placed in a position to choose the highest of the bidders.

Fat ugly women aren't likely to get many or high bids, maybe even none, thus showing that "he" has and makes many choices in his bidding and is "empowered" thereby.

Either way, when you have people bidding on you, it's plain to see that you hold more leverage than the bidders. Besides, big girls get theirs.

[rebecca702]

What men value is Woman, in every sense that term entails. They seek a biological woman to embody this. Men sometimes choose a specific woman, but not always. They think they've done the choosing, but they don't recognise the subtle signals that a woman gives out when in reality she's chosen him.

However, a man never chooses his success with a specific woman. If she doesn't choose him, he's screwed no matter what he does.

It's hard to say what the rate is at which one sex does the actual choosing. It's hard to say in how many instances a man thinks he's chosen a woman when he's simply oblivious to the fact that she has lured him with sub-conscious behaviour.

In that last bit I'm not sure if you meant the behavior acts on the man's subconscious, or comes from the woman's subconscious, or both. I would assume you mean both. Because I think women are very often oblivious to those "subtle signals" then are putting out. Seems some men are giving women far too much credit, assuming that they are plotting and scheming, when in reality the woman might not actually know she's doing anything (the idea Woman is doing it). She's just filling in the role and trying to BE that idea as best she can, because that's her wellspring of self-esteem.

Nick states this too:

I'm talking about the philosophical ideal of Woman, something biological women, along with men, have also accepted. Women become it, men worship it.

So Dan, the "raw Will to Power" (you mentioned earlier in the thread) women are attracted to is the conscious drive for survival that men have? Do you mean that the way Nietzsche does? I'm wondering in this context if it has to do with simple fear at the root: woman is afraid of death, of aloneness, of reality, and has no faith in her own ability to succeed, so she must place all her expectations on someone else. He will save her from the boogeyman.

[skipair]

Rebecca and Sue, I have no idea what planet you come from, but please bring everyone else. Amazing.

[sue hindmarsh]

Skip,

You'll have to describe what you're finding "Amazing"? Then I'll know whether or not your planet is anywhere in our vicinity.

[skipair]

It's amazingly uncommon to find people who share my thoughts.

[sue hindmarsh]

What "thoughts" are they, Skip?

[sue hindmarsh]

I've been meaning to ask you about some of your thoughts. Now seems appropriate.

Skip wrote:

Sue: aren't you the tiniest bit afraid that all this time you are devoting to working hard so that women notice you - and thereby always having to be on their level just so that they can see you - that you yourself will entirely morph into woman yourself?

Yes. This is why I'm disgusted with myself sometimes. Sometimes it scares me how I'm not disgusted by it.

For example, I look down upon women getting all their plastic surgery. My Mom has breast implants and my sister had eye surgery to correct a lazy eye. "How weak and shallow they are," I thought! But recently, I'll get an erection and squeeze the base of my dick. The more I do this the more my dick grows in general. Women see the buldge and give me lots of attention. But this is no different from girls getting their surgery. Yet, I apparently don't look down upon it enough in myself to stop. Instead I just carry a bad conscience.

Too much info?

Not enough info, actually. Are you describing a scenario where you are parading yourself in front of a group of women with a “bulge” in your pants?

If that’s what you're doing, a life as a dirty-old-man could well be in your future.
-
This “conscience” of yours. Does it ever intervene at any point in your life?

[Shahrazad]

Nick,

What matters most is that the man has accepted Woman as something of value. Any role as he plays in choosing at this point doesn't amount to anything more than that of a bidder at an auction where the woman is empowered and placed in a position to choose the highest of the bidders.

I can easily turn this around and say the opposite, just to show that your perspective is arbitrary:

What matters most is that the woman has accepted Man as something of value. Any role as she plays in choosing at this point doesn't amount to anything more than that of an object at an auction where the man is placed in a position to place the bids. In this scenario, the man's ability to choose carries much more weight than a woman's.

Either way, when you have people bidding on you, it's plain to see that you hold more leverage than the bidders.

It's not plain to see that the object holds more leverage than the bidder. In fact, a bidder who has unlimited funds can take whatever object he wants, while the object can't make a bidder become interested.

Besides, big girls get theirs.

For that study, "big" was anyone who was 5 pounds overweight. Try doing that poll with women who are 100+ pounds overweight, and see how much sex they are getting. Hint: they aren't getting any.

You are a QRS wannabe, Nick. But your shtick is not as good as theirs. Keep working on it.

[jupta]

It is interesting to see how the issue of men and women is not resolved even in a philosophy forum. This is proof that men and women will never change, and the majority of men will always be on women like a fat girl on twinkies. But I digress.

I can easily turn this around and say the opposite, just to show that your perspective is arbitrary:

What matters most is that the woman has accepted Man as something of value. Any role as she plays in choosing at this point doesn't amount to anything more than that of an object at an auction where the man is placed in a position to place the bids. In this scenario, the man's ability to choose carries much more weight than a woman's.

You can't be the 'acceptor' if you do not do something that puts you in a position to do so.

It's not plain to see that the object holds more leverage than the bidder. In fact, a bidder who has unlimited funds can take whatever object he wants, while the object can't make a bidder become interested.

For a bidder who doesn't have unlimited funds however...