Beyond God and Evil

Discussion of the nature of Ultimate Reality and the path to Enlightenment.
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Shahrazad
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Re: Beyond God and Evil

Post by Shahrazad »

Good one, Carl.
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Alex Jacob
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Re: Beyond God and Evil

Post by Alex Jacob »

A Jungian synchronistic approach to SC exegesis:

"The Abyss at 2:21 past the noontide."

Timothy, 2:21?

"Steven the "Jungian/Shaman" has scoped a slew of "quasi-golden" synchronistic scarabs over the past week... They were even causally attributed 'soul's (psyches) of other persons... ("soul transmigration"). Only to be resynchronized in time at a later date (retrocognition)."

2Ti 2:19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.

2Ti 2:20 But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour.

2Ti 2:21 If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, [and] prepared unto every good work.

2Ti 2:22 Flee also youthful lusts: but follow righteousness, faith, charity, peace, with them that call on the Lord out of a pure heart.
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Steven Coyle

Re: Beyond God and Evil

Post by Steven Coyle »

Good one, Alex.

Thanks.

Recommend any texts on Shamanism? Nature's been teaching me thus far.
brokenhead
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Re: Beyond God and Evil

Post by brokenhead »

Steven Coyle wrote:Good one, Alex.

Thanks.

Recommend any texts on Shamanism? Nature's been teaching me thus far.
And doing a fine job, it must noted.
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Dan Rowden
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Re: Beyond God and Evil

Post by Dan Rowden »

Carl G wrote:
Steven Nietzsche wrote:As a hummingbird hovers outside my window...
...I, posting all the way, descend into my madness.
I don't know what's happened to Seven but he is looking decidedly odd of late. One hopes it's not serious.
Steven Coyle

Re: Beyond God and Evil

Post by Steven Coyle »

Daniel.

Your need to imitate (or support, perhaps) The Shah of Panama, is telling.

(Ya kind of sound remarkably like a bitch, holmes.)
Steven Coyle

Re: Beyond God and Evil

Post by Steven Coyle »

Maybe though, I should cut out the true testaments from my time here on the farm. Ya know, actually seeing other's within insects (and other wholesome things) - then having these same persons describe what I divined at a later date.
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Dan Rowden
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Re: Beyond God and Evil

Post by Dan Rowden »

Steven Coyle wrote:Daniel.

Your need to imitate (or support, perhaps) The Shah of Panama, is telling.

(Ya kind of sound remarkably like a bitch, holmes.)
That may be true, but I don't resile from the observation that you seem like a very different man - and not in a good way - from the Steven I've known. I was expressing concern, and I think it's warranted.
Steven Coyle

Re: Beyond God and Evil

Post by Steven Coyle »

Probably the artist in me. That 'tincture of madness exploring, and probing the inner regions of spacetime...
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Dan Rowden
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Re: Beyond God and Evil

Post by Dan Rowden »

Oh, well, that makes me feel a whole lot better.
Steven Coyle

Re: Beyond God and Evil

Post by Steven Coyle »

In the midst of traversing the Zen depths (after Satori practice) which go pretty deep.
Iolaus
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Re: Beyond God and Evil

Post by Iolaus »

David,
I see you still do not get my point. God does not require anything. There simply is evidence for Him. You are the one who insists on calling that evidence "cheap stunts." I am saying this event had meaning and was not a coincidence. I am saying the deeper your faith in a personal God, the more your God participates in your life because you are inviting Him to.
See, your prejudice shows in the mocking words you choose. (Yes, I realize the above was written by Brokenhead.) Saying things like alien God, fairy God and cheap stunts.

Anyway, I don't really see the thing like BH does. One can think of the unerring intelligence of the universe, a field of information into which one can tap. One could call it the mind of God, or just the Star Wars Force.

I don't see BH's experience as one of a stunt performed by a separate entity, but rather of one in which he has allowed himself to interact with this ever so subtle and seething underlying energy-mind-information field, has opened himself to it and its possibilities.

I don't say that field is a personal God or that it isn't a personal God. I think it is too vast to use our little names for.

What I glean from my readings on science and biology, is that our world that we perceive with our bodily senses, is built up upon the very, very tiny. Tiny physical particles, unimaginably tiny, and also tiny energies that we cannot easily pick up. This is not so hard to agree with, when you consider, that our instruments have found things which in all these past thousands of years we could have absolutely no conception of.

The electromagnetic spectrum. Waves of tiny photons traveling through space. Empty space is not empty, but a seething quantum energy field. No information is lost.

Maybe, David, it's the mind of God. Not a God sitting in a golden chair. But that the brain of God encompasses and fills the entire universe.
Truth is a pathless land.
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Alex Jacob
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Re: Beyond God and Evil

Post by Alex Jacob »

Iolaus,

You joined GF at 3:14, and once again---for reasons I do not feign to comprehend---we have a direct syncronistic link to 2 Timothy.

3:14 But you, remain faithful to what you have learned and believed, because you know from whom you learned it...

My post was posted at 2:06 (2:6) which gives us 1 Peter

'This is why it says in Scripture: "Look! I am laying a chosen, precious cornerstone in Zion. The one who believes in him will never be ashamed."

...which is pretty much what I keep REPEATING all the time!

;-)
___________________________________________________________

"Maybe, David, it's the mind of God. Not a God sitting in a golden chair. But that the brain of God encompasses and fills the entire universe."

I tend to see things like that. I also think that Kevin describes a God of 'all that is', but I have not been able to understand his idea of God, nor that of Quinn or Rowden. I think sometimes we are people shouting across the edges of precipices, trying to make ourselves understood, but there are just some basic, missing pieces in the conception-of-world that, for strange reasons, no one wants to discover and label. In the GF 'confusion of tongues' it seems we'd rather remain in mutually opposed camps, rather than try to 'build bridges'. Uf! Excuse me! Did I say 'build bridges'? Oy veh is mir. Real men don't 'build bridges', or do they? (I've gotten my metaphors in a bundle so will now sign-off).

PS: Steven, the books I most enjoyed, on the sage-sprinkled Great Plains of Colorado, when everything was sooooooo much simpler, were the books by Joan Halifax, for example The Wounded Healer and Shamanic Voices.

Blessings from the ETs to all of you... Keep your eyes peeled for PLAYING CARDS with mystical meaning you may find on the path you walk. I wish hearts on your raods, but if it must be swords then it must be swords.
Ni ange, ni bête
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Carl G
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Re: Beyond God and Evil

Post by Carl G »

Alex going all King James on us, something I would have never expected to see.
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Leyla Shen
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Re: Beyond God and Evil

Post by Leyla Shen »

Dan Rowden wrote:Oh, well, that makes me feel a whole lot better.
What do you expect when actually pissing in the wind, Dan?

I don't know why you bothered to mention it!
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David Quinn
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Re: Beyond God and Evil

Post by David Quinn »

Iolaus wrote: David,
I see you still do not get my point. God does not require anything. There simply is evidence for Him. You are the one who insists on calling that evidence "cheap stunts." I am saying this event had meaning and was not a coincidence. I am saying the deeper your faith in a personal God, the more your God participates in your life because you are inviting Him to.

See, your prejudice shows in the mocking words you choose. (Yes, I realize the above was written by Brokenhead.) Saying things like alien God, fairy God and cheap stunts.
I don't see these things as mocking words, but rather as accurate characterizations.

The bottom line is that perceiving and understanding and experiencing God (the true God, the Infinite) is not a matter of singling out particular chains of events, no matter how unusual they might seem to be, and using them as evidence that there is indeed a God. Rather, it is about opening ones eyes, seeing God in all chains of events, and immersing yourself in his nature.

Personally, I'm so constantly blown away at every little thing that happens, reveling in God's nature in all that occurs, that the idea of seeking out unusual experiences in order to have a greater experience of God has no meaning for me. It is a like rich man living in a palace and having an abundance of everything he needs and desires, and then being told that there is a person at the gates wanting to sell him a cheap trinket. The rich man just laughs.

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David Quinn
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Re: Beyond God and Evil

Post by David Quinn »

Alex Jacob wrote:I tend to see things like that. I also think that Kevin describes a God of 'all that is', but I have not been able to understand his idea of God, nor that of Quinn or Rowden.
God is right before our very eyes in this very moment, his nature is always fully revealed. But people need to stop piling on top of it what they want to see.

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Dan Rowden
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Re: Beyond God and Evil

Post by Dan Rowden »

The distinction between "usual" and "unusual" ought set off alarm bells. What could there be in the nature of the "unusual" that makes it so? Surely, only that it is not usual. Why is that a big deal and why does it cause one to look for God in it? Me winning Lotto would be unusual. Should I go looking for a God that cares about me if I do?
brokenhead
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Re: Beyond God and Evil

Post by brokenhead »

DQ wrote:The bottom line is that perceiving and understanding and experiencing God (the true God, the Infinite) is not a matter of singling out particular chains of events, no matter how unusual they might seem to be, and using them as evidence that there is indeed a God. Rather, it is about opening ones eyes, seeing God in all chains of events, and immersing yourself in his nature.
Of course God is in all chain of events. Did I or anyone else say or imply otherwise? Once again, you are missing the point, but missing the point seems to be one of the pillars of your so-called philosophy. This merely was an instance of a question and and answer. This particular chain of events happened to me and I related them here because it was unusual and meaningful, or so I thought.
Personally, I'm so constantly blown away at every little thing that happens, reveling in God's nature in all that occurs, that the idea of seeking out unusual experiences in order to have a greater experience of God has no meaning for me. It is a like rich man living in a palace and having an abundance of everything he needs and desires, and then being told that there is a person at the gates wanting to sell him a cheap trinket. The rich man just laughs.
Well, me too. But who said anything about seeking out unusual experiences? I didn't go out of my way to seek anything but a guy who needed a jump. I'm not an impulsive person by nature. I can be spontaneous, but that's different. I am quite sorry, I'm sure, that my "cheap trinket" failed to interest you, but it was startling to me when it happened and I thought I would try to share it with you. I am not trying to impress you, or anyone else, David. I guess you you would have had to have been there. But you would never have been there and you never will be there, because you are too preoccupied in you palace with all it's "riches." You philosophise about God, but you are too busy "laughing" at the wretches at your gate whom you proceed to send away to ever know Him.
Beingof1
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Re: Beyond God and Evil

Post by Beingof1 »

David Quinn wrote:Iolaus:
See, your prejudice shows in the mocking words you choose. (Yes, I realize the above was written by Brokenhead.) Saying things like alien God, fairy God and cheap stunts.

David:
I don't see these things as mocking words, but rather as accurate characterizations.
My accurate characterization of you saying they are "cheap parlor tricks" is density.
The bottom line is that perceiving and understanding and experiencing God (the true God, the Infinite) is not a matter of singling out particular chains of events, no matter how unusual they might seem to be, and using them as evidence that there is indeed a God. Rather, it is about opening ones eyes, seeing God in all chains of events, and immersing yourself in his nature.
Oh, is that so? Except your "accurate characterizations"? How do you know they are accurate?

Let me get this straight, you can see God in a cup, but you cannot see God in what you have made a choice to exclude?
http://www.alltm.org/pages/crime-arrested.html

Yup - logic is paramount unless it conflicts with your philosophy and then - you toss logic right out the window. How is that working for you?
Personally, I'm so constantly blown away at every little thing that happens, reveling in God's nature in all that occurs, that the idea of seeking out unusual experiences in order to have a greater experience of God has no meaning for me. It is a like rich man living in a palace and having an abundance of everything he needs and desires, and then being told that there is a person at the gates wanting to sell him a cheap trinket. The rich man just laughs.
[/quote][/quote]

I had a speaking engagement in Phoenix Arizona at a hotel conference room at 18th Ave. and Camelback in 1994. Carl knows where this is, it was the Ramada Inn.

After the meeting, a lifelong friend of mine named Scott Thurston and I were outside talking when right in front of our eyes, a girl was hit by a car as she was riding a bycicle. She went end over end over the car and impacted onto the street behind the car.

I, moved by instinct, ran over to her and Scott followed. She was laying sprawled in the middle of the road. I layed my hands on her and began to pray. I could feel, under my hands, the bones in her body popping back into place. My friend Scott said later he could hear them and see her body twist back into shape. She was just staring at me and did not say a word.

In the background I heard one woman in the crowd saying:" The man of God has prayed for you sweetheart, you are healed." There was another voice that said; "Do not move her, you may injure her."

My friend Scott, knelt down in front of her and said;"Get up." She was instantly healed and raised herself up, all the while just staring at me with a kind of blank shock in her face.

The paramedics arrived and she was hustled away and I and my friend blended away through the crowd.

Say what you want to David, I live it and have seen, that is why I am a believer.

I share these things with you so that it may be a catalyst that allows you to open your mind beyond your repulsing mindset.

If you do not want to talk with me anymore - okey dokey, but you have no idea what you are missing by not allowing yourself a smudge of humility.
Iolaus
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Re: Beyond God and Evil

Post by Iolaus »

Beingof1

How do you pray?
Truth is a pathless land.
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David Quinn
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Re: Beyond God and Evil

Post by David Quinn »

brokenhead wrote:
DQ wrote:The bottom line is that perceiving and understanding and experiencing God (the true God, the Infinite) is not a matter of singling out particular chains of events, no matter how unusual they might seem to be, and using them as evidence that there is indeed a God. Rather, it is about opening ones eyes, seeing God in all chains of events, and immersing yourself in his nature.
Of course God is in all chain of events. Did I or anyone else say or imply otherwise? Once again, you are missing the point, but missing the point seems to be one of the pillars of your so-called philosophy. This merely was an instance of a question and and answer. This particular chain of events happened to me and I related them here because it was unusual and meaningful, or so I thought.
So you agree, then, that from a spiritual perspective the incident was insignificant, having no more significance than that of, say, a mite of dust settling on a table?

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Alex Jacob
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Re: Beyond God and Evil

Post by Alex Jacob »

I'm curious about your view on the Bible as encoded scripture, Mr Beingof1.
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Carl G
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Re: Beyond God and Evil

Post by Carl G »

And while you're at it, Mr Being, what do make of crop circles?
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Dan Rowden
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Re: Beyond God and Evil

Post by Dan Rowden »

And was the Tin Man really a CIA agent?
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