Universal Consciousness or Oneness

[elderwoodxxx]

A blog dealing with the Truth of enlightenment, through wisdom, logic and truth based on universal understanding from a christian viewpoint. Although the vedic scriptures, the Upanishads, talk of a sea of consciousness and eternal truths. One consciousness and different cultural history all form the understanding. :-)

http://uk.blog.360.yahoo.com/elderwoodxxx

FOR ALL Entry for 05 June 2008
AS ONE IN YOU FOR ALL


Dear father and lord of all that you are, the Almighty one of All things, long you dwell in your temple and yet not long. Your work is soon to be complete. Your spirit now shines to all as one through Jesus Christ whom you made as our atonement for sin in continued ignorance of you. Know that your will is being made known and that many do not rest night and day until they have made you known to all man of this world.


Confusion reigns in mans world, even though you have redeemed many purchased by your blood. May you continue to purchase souls in your righteousness and perfection and may many who are still lost see with their hearts and mind that you hold the keys to Hades and that your will is made known for All as One.


Your spirit is pouring fourth as One and your will is upholding your eternal law for completion. Let man now see how he makes his own wrath as verily he harvests his own desires. I am as ever your most humble servant whom you have renewed with your might, Spirit and world, with your eternal mercy, grace and love.


Your consciousness as One with All things is being made known to those whom still cannot hear you in the fact that I have heard many things about their belief. There is some confusion in mind that they are many things, unaware of being purchased through your blood, will and might. They shine lights of your making in accordance with your will of all that IS. You dwell in their bodies joining them in spirit to the stars through Jesus Christ our Lord and saviour, our redeemer, our atonement. May his grace be known to all man, as the key to the freedom of ALL. By your consciousness you lift us up through him, so that as men like him we can come to you in light and love as now One in unity.



Oh lord I long for the day of your glory to be made known to all nations as One, for your heaven to be realised for all man in you. To be realised as man for you. You make all things possible so that we can turn and love all things, knowing that you have sent them in accordance with your most perfect design and will. Please keep me close to you so that the world may bathe in the glory of your light. You dwell in the bodies of those you redeem and through them you are made known to the world. We are now becoming One dear Lord so that All expressing for the many can shine as lights in expression of the One, made possible through your power, gifts of grace and eternal unconditional love for All things.


You are bringing your heaven to Earth, by raising your Earth in consciousness as now ONE. We are coming together in light of our divinity as One and together we can all help change our world in peace and harmony, ready for the time that you choose to once more dwell among us as one in eternity, wrapped in immortality and strengthened from within all hearts joined as One, as ALL.


Like ancient times past, long before and when you made the new world for All, let us now shine in glory as a united shower of your might. Show the people that are strangers to you that they are now only deceiving themselves and the cups they pour are of their own making. You hold the keys dear Lord and have set them among men to shine as stars, lighting the way for your return into our presence.

You have shown me the might of your selfless love which set me free from death of mans world and renewed my spirit within me, so that I may understand your strength within the illusion of a mans heart hardened by the world around me. You allow me to see all hearts and minds as One with a heart that is already free. You gave me my freedom so that I could do your will by showing me why mans hearts have become hard. You showed me how to understand why the illusion created in density encases many hearts, cutting them off from you.


Forever have I searched a mans heart to find one that I could understand as my own. None did I find except yours, which has taught me how to love most perfectly, without the shadows of man dimming my light. You gave me your heart so that I may search all others and allow man to understand that all hearts are ONE. For in you we beat as One, a voice on the winds of eternity, consciousness now together, alive in the oceans of immortality.


You are my God who makes all things possible and with you, possible are all things. I am born of man, joined as One through Christ to be reborn a child of light. I am now all that IS. Through your graceful mercy, you redeemed me unto you, you set my soul FREE. You have given me pure free will in the escape from entrapments of selfish ego desire, and helped me to understand why I was already free yet once blinded in Self doubts darkness of a fallen worldly demise.


You made me so I could understand you. You make us ALL.


Amanda Thomas 2008


An eye for an eye will make the whole world blind...........Ghandi

[Ryan Rudolph]

Amanda,

An eye for an eye will make the whole world blind...........Ghandi

its a good quote, but can you discover what the causes of revenge are?

[elderwoodxxx]

Causes of revenge?

Ok ill give it a go.. Many seek revenge through a bitterness of feeling that they are owed something in a world that has seemingly betrayed them.. egos fuel greed and desire for power and control. Materialistic gain fuels mans want and selfish desires. Lack of self belief allows people to take and others to either give through kindness and knowing or to fight in defense of their perceived rights and liberties. The battle of good verses evil has always played out upon this third dimensional realm. It is here that man is trapped in the cycle of negative density while continually seeking redemption. Misunderstanding fuels limited perception through a desire to prove another wrong through conceit and 1upmanship. It is not about who is right or wrong it is merely different perception or levels of awareness. There is no right or wrong just different understanding. perceptions are infinite in truth yet mans limitations are those that he places upon himself. Humility is acknowledging ones limitations and then you grow.. for perceived weakness tends to be our greatest virtues and grace.

Amandaxxx

[elderwoodxxx]

Just another piece ;-)

INSPIRATION

When words are born true and others dismay
At your feelings you know to be right
Take heart in the fact they have their own way
For deaf ears blind them from true sight

Respect in those wishes that others portray
For light at times is so dark
Acknowledge their fears to ‘see’ what they say
For their bite is much worse than their bark

Stand back and let go and take no blame
For others ignorance and fear
Rise above woe and understand shame
Hold yourself true to everything dear

One day they may see how wrongly they thought
About life and the game that it plays
And time will unfold upon actions they wrought
Upon feelings to heed their own ways

For so blind at times we all really are
Through illusions of shadows and fear
Know your self worth and of others afar
And equality for all will appear

Deep down in all hearts we know what is right
Even when shadowed by greed
Sometimes choices we make are never that light
So be aware of others in need

Set yourself free and follow your dreams
Realise just who you are
Not a slave to the world however it seems
But intense as a far off star

For together we shine ever so bright
In a world full of beauty to see
Dissolve all those shadows recapture your sight
See exactly what we can all be

Dark is our time in a world that is choked
Exploited through greed and self gain
Take heart in these words upon you invoked
Or dark will this time here remain

Humans have conscience and powerful love
Why be blind from simple desire
Have peace in a world that fits like a glove
Turn a blind eye forever in fire

Awake from your daze from illusions of fear
And welcome grace all entwined
For in hearts everywhere pure love can appear
Simultaneously we can no longer be blind

Reach up for those stars that shine so bright
Allow yourself to feel
Within everyone we all have a light
That is there and that no one can steal

Our world is our home a gift to us all
A place for us to be
Our thanks is destruction we think is our call
Why can we not but see

The beauty is here it’s a pleasure to give
Why ‘think’ we all must take
The choices we have in trying to live
Are those for us to make

Free will is our gift of our life on this earth
Its what drives our every whim
Know what is good and give it rebirth
Forgive and stop living in sin

Don’t turn that blind eye for an easier life
Why do you want to give in
For united as one we can vanquish all strife
And together we can really all win

Peace in the world in our hearts and our dreams
Release all selfish desires
Let go the façade the ego it seems
Does choke your pure inner fires

In false names we war in quests just for peace
Bringing poverty chaos and pain
Why vanquish those foes with a war you can cease
In the path of a righteous true name

Know life as a gift so precious and blessed
Don’t waste time in the falseness of greed
Find your spirit in grace and know life at its best
Give rebirth to your pure inner seed

Every human can love every human can see
How special we all really are
Trust in your heart and set yourself free
Find within your burning bright star

amanda 2007

[Alex Jacob]

To live and have a root in the world, to own things in the world, to have stock in the world and to achieve and excel in the world, requires a factual and not an idealistic understanding of 'how things work'. One only gains that knowledge through owning and directing things. You can't rule from the mountain-top down, you can only rule in and amongst men. And one of the first rules of rulership, and one that all rulers and leaders are keenly aware of, is the necessity of punishment. Laxity is recognized as weakness, and he who cannot punish is often he who is simply weak or inexperienced. To be lax or too forgiving is to inculcate and support unruly behavior. Sun Tzu writes about the ruler's attitude toward the military power that he directs: Dazzle them with rewards when faithful, awe them with punishments when disobedient. The same is basically true in any power situation whether personal or political. Punishment is one of the fundamental rules that interweaves all of social interactions and exchanges.

From a Christian perspective (Gandhi was speaking from a Christian perspective when he wrote that because the notion of punishment and the need of punishment is not problematic in Hindu culture) there are very severe punishments there waiting for the rebellious sinner, indeed they are the most severe one can imagine. So, if one were to practice---I mean really practice---the values of the Sermon of the Mount, the 'world' would simply tread all over you and you'd have nothing left to defend. Then you could simply wander the Earth or stop eating and die, or simply degenerate economically and in so many other ways. But to attempt to practice a viable Christian ethic while living in the world, rooting oneself in the world, building and amassing in the world, requires a modification of the suicidal Christian ethic. That is just a fact. In that, your punishments, the ones you mete out, have to be well-considered, studied even. If you are in a position where you perceive you are dealing with a 'sinner' (murder, theft, deceit) you have got to mete punishments but you must remain aware of what exactly you are doing and why. You cannot merely walk away from all responsibility and leave the issue to someone else. Well, in fact you can, and many do.

The whole purpose of punishment is to leave permanent marks, permanent wounds if you will. Punishment is a kind of scaring, sometimes it is delicate and artistic, sometimes it is outrightly brutal and obscene (anyone read In The Penal Colony by Franz Kafka? It is a marvellous treatise on Nietzsche's notions of punishment). Even moral lectures and the game of standing over someone and using one's psychic force to 'cause' them to feel remorse is a rite of administering wounds. And should it happen that your unwilling victim just laughs at you and throws sand in your face, mocking you, what are you going to do? Pray for him? (....and the hot coals rain down from heaven, singing him permanently).

Also, Life is a brutal punishment artist, and comes up with the most intricate (delicate and also brutal) punishments for all the sinners running around on the Earth. Exquisite situational torture sessions await you! Though you laugh now, later you will cry bitter tears. Count on God to personally administer to you punishments that...will leave you numb. And then., you die. Okay, I am hamming it up for effect, but the point is valid. A doctrine of a Law of Karma indicates precisely what I have just described. As ye mete, so shall it be meted out to you. The punishments of God are just unutterably strange and the long arm of Divine Justice...can stretch forever. But in the end 'God always gets his man'.
_____________________________________________

This is the second in a series of Nietzschean Lectures delivered to the enthralled congregation in the Tragical Church of Zarathustra by the Right Reverand Alex Jacob...

;-)
_____________________________________________

(It is gonna take a day or so to pull together my thoughts enough Anna to continue on the man-woman theme...I dreamed of an elephant and a little girl last night and it put me into some sort of fuzz).

[tek0]

I still love you guys and I read everything here.

I may not have a farking clue about some of it and yet some of it hits me in my funny bone.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QpWwWKdn ... re=related

[Ryan Rudolph]

Amanda,

Materialistic gain fuels mans want and selfish desires.

it seems to me that man's materialistic desires are rooted in his desire to possess a woman sexually/romantically. Isn't romantic relationships the cause of much of man's plight and foolishness?

If man and woman exist as friends, then rational discourse should be their communication, rather than romantic sentiment and an emotional addiction to sexual intercourse.

[elderwoodxxx]

it seems to me that man's materialistic desires are rooted in his desire to possess a woman sexually/romantically. Isn't romantic relationships the cause of much of man's plight and foolishness?

If man and woman exist as friends, then rational discourse should be their communication, rather than romantic sentiment and an emotional addiction to sexual intercourse

Yes mans desires to 'own' a woman as an object cause much confusion and frustration between the two. While writing my words of understanding i have had men fall at my feet in an attempt to own me. leading to much anger from themselves, or rather from their ego or for want of a better term 'devil' Pure Love is born from selflessness.. which means unconditionally giving without expectation of any reward.. the reward is with the act of selfless praise and gratitude for who the other IS. The reward IS a smile and joy. If two perceive this then their souls burn as they become united in spirit, and bodily desire then sets in. My personal experience was of this. Trust expels all fear between two and minds are then free to communicate rationally and logically. The conversations i once had with someone led to complete awareness in objectivity. We transcended the subjective nature of the mind. It always remained pure as we spoke online with cams. we did not even touch, time became illusion and the 'now' was perceived.

I have written about this on one of my first blogs.. http://uk.blog.360.yahoo.com/blog-.CxYD ... x=44&lmt=5

At the time i 'thought' i was in love and yes it was pure.. through circumstances we parted communication and i slipped into turmoil..until i realised through self analysis what had actually happened. I saw through it ALL. I woke up. There were basic rules ie selflessness, purity, love etc.. I have written them down but i cannot recall them in accuracy at present. I then wrote more and discovered that it was doctrine. Then i discovered theosophy etc.. My whole journey of awareness was made easy for me as i already knew what IS and how to understand to perceive it. I am now creating my own consciousness by formulating new truth with universal understanding. We are ALL dream makers lost within the illusion of perceived reality. Consciousness and energy is all things.
Looking over my writing as a whole I have been creating with my understanding, universal timeless understanding, taking the reader on a journey bringing their inside out through Self belief in who they are. Truths of eternal validity.. the word IS creation fuelled from creation itself, or source. I am aware of what I am conceiving and I am aware that I have free will to be able to do so.. I have had many men fall at my feet, unable to think of no other… that would make sense to me as it appears that they are falling under my ‘spell’ one that is born from unconditional love for all that IS. That is why I began to become aware of the power within my words. Power is a side effect and the whole world is mine in essence as it is for ALL..our destiny lies within understanding our own consciousness and within this density we can see all that which we are not. I see through people.

When I ‘awoke’ I saw the reality that IS and then became aware of the illusion we are in. My writing then served to fuel my awareness in relation to ALL understanding. I fell asleep one night as a golden arc of light came to me.. I had such a lucid dream when I slept that upon awaking I proceeded to automatically write 40 a4 pages in relation to perceiving the illusion, weaving the words as I went.. I have yet to type much of my work. I have perceived that I have become my sub-conscious.. I am consciousness. My own master as i am master of truth by owning negativity and transmuting it to light with understanding.. i am One expressing for the many as part of the many in expression of the one.

amandaxxx

[samadhi]

If man and woman exist as friends, then rational discourse should be their communication, rather than romantic sentiment and an emotional addiction to sexual intercourse.

Ryan, are you see on that anti-sex kick? Is it really your position that no one should have sex?

[elderwoodxxx]

Ryan, are you see on that anti-sex kick? Is it really your position that no one should have sex?

I know that is not what he is saying.. But for man and woman to genuinly be able to have adequate converse the goal should not be sexual self gratification. For through desire and sexual want, things become clouded.. If a relationship is based on that then what else is there?? Of course I am not Ryan and i am sure he will give you his own thoughts.

Amandaxxx

[Ryan Rudolph]

Sam,

Ryan, are you see on that anti-sex kick? Is it really your position that no one should have sex?

It isn’t a kick Sam, it is one of the major pillars of enlighenement, a man is not complete until he has totally faced death, until he has totally faced his fear of loneliness, totally faced his addiction to feminine warmth and affection, and totally faced his fear of not living a conventional family life in the eyes of his parents and friends. He must stand totally alone, without a single crutch, not attached to a single idea, dogma, woman, or anything. He must abandon all delusional beliefs, all love obsessions, and mature fully into the enlightened superman. And sex is a major hurtle, as men live and die for sex. They live their entire lives to satisfy that urge.

A man is empty spiritually is he is constantly longing for sensual gratification, constantly longing to complete himself through the merging with another. To transcend ego requires that the animal brain is shut down in the man’s mind, he must experience a denial of the animal cravings for a prolonged period of time, his neocortex must be fully in control to analyze the empirical reality coldly without the invention of the emotions. In essence, his heart must become hard like stone, and then he is truly compassionate….

[samadhi]

Ryan,

sam: are you [still] on that anti-sex kick? Is it really your position that no one should have sex?

Ryan: It isn’t a kick Sam, it is one of the major pillars of enlighenement, a man is not complete until he has totally faced death, until he has totally faced his fear of loneliness, totally faced his addiction to feminine warmth and affection, and totally faced his fear of not living a conventional family life in the eyes of his parents and friends. He must stand totally alone, without a single crutch, not attached to a single idea, dogma, woman, or anything. He must abandon all delusional beliefs, all love obsessions, and mature fully into the enlightened superman. And sex is a major hurtle, as men live and die for sex. They live their entire lives to satisfy that urge.

The problem with this description is that you are mistaking the outer for the inner, actions as attachments. This has been the emphasis of religions from the start and why they always go astray. Renouncing is not about what is given up on the outside but about what is given up on the inside. The Buddha himself began as a renunciate of actions and decided it didn't work. Only when he gave up the idea that perfecting an image is what is important did he discover the middle path. The middle path is not about renunciation. Check it out.

A man is empty spiritually is he is constantly longing for sensual gratification, constantly longing to complete himself through the merging with another. To transcend ego requires that the animal brain is shut down in the man’s mind, he must experience a denial of the animal cravings for a prolonged period of time, his neocortex must be fully in control to analyze the empirical reality coldly without the invention of the emotions. In essence, his heart must become hard like stone, and then he is truly compassionate….

Sensual gratification is not a matter of what actions you take but what attachments you crave. Your mistaking action for attachment is a beginning's misunderstanding. You yourself seem to crave a certain image, that of renunciate. Maybe renouncing of certain actions is the way for you, after all we each have our own individual path. But in the end if you are serving an image, even one of a renunciate, your attachment to it will keep you from seeing that enlightenment is not about what you do but about who you are.

[Ryan Rudolph]

Sam,

The middle path is not about renunciation.

Renunciation is inevitable because if one extinguishes the emotional motivations for enjoying certain vices, then they no longer have a hold over the mind. And it no longer makes sense to pursue them at all.

Sensual gratification is not a matter of what actions you take but what attachments you crave. Your mistaking action for attachment is a beginning's misunderstanding. You yourself seem to crave a certain image, that of renunciate. Maybe renouncing of certain actions is the way for you, after all we each have our own individual path. But in the end if you are serving an image, even one of a renunciate, your attachment to it will keep you from seeing that enlightenment is not about what you do but about who you are.

You are what you do though, I do not divide actions from their inward affects. You are the sum of all your affects. What else are you besides all the affects of your actions? I don't think there is anything else there.

[samadhi]

Ryan,

sam: The middle path is not about renunciation.

Ryan: Renunciation is inevitable because if one extinguishes the emotional motivations for enjoying certain vices, then they no longer have a hold over the mind. And it no longer makes sense to pursue them at all.

But that isn't renunciation, it is simply the dropping away of what no longer serves you.

sam: ... in the end if you are serving an image, even one of a renunciate, your attachment to it will keep you from seeing that enlightenment is not about what you do but about who you are.

Ryan: You are what you do though, I do not divide actions from their inward affects.

Would you say someone who gives up sex and agonizes over it has actually given up anything? On the other hand, without attachment, where is the harm in the action?

You are the sum of all your affects. What else are you besides all the affects of your actions? I don't think there is anything else there.

The effect of an action is a matter of intention. Where there is no intent to harm, nor craving to possess, but a willingness to share openly and cultivate oneness, where is the problem?

You seem to reject an attraction to beauty. Is it only female beauty you reject or is it all beauty?

[Ryan Rudolph]

Sam,

Would you say someone who gives up sex and agonizes over it has actually given up anything? On the other hand, without attachment, where is the harm in the action?

No they haven’t given up anything, but on the other hand, you can easily justify continuing the pursuing of a karma causing behavior by saying, “oh, I’m not attached to it, so it is okay” But the fact is that the other party usually is so you are inflicting suffering when its not necessary. At least with the declaration of a behavior’s danger, it can lead to a permanent avoidance of the pursuit.

You seem to reject an attraction to beauty. Is it only female beauty you reject or is it all beauty?

You cannot choose not to be attracted to a beautiful member of the opposite sex, it is a law in nature, however, one can negate the temptation to play all the games to keep that beauty in your life over the long-term.

[samadhi]

Ryan,

sam: Would you say someone who gives up sex and agonizes over it has actually given up anything? On the other hand, without attachment, where is the harm in the action?

Ryan: No they haven’t given up anything, but on the other hand, you can easily justify continuing the pursuing of a karma causing behavior by saying, "oh, I’m not attached to it, so it is okay."

Well, that happens regardless. I'm sure there are things you're attached to that you justify by thinking you aren't attached. My point is that your preaching against sexual behavior is meaningless when there is an internal sexual drive. You don't deal with an internal drive by simply denying it. That leads to a lot of unfortunate and avoidable complications.

But the fact is that the other party usually is so you are inflicting suffering when its not necessary. At least with the declaration of a behavior’s danger, it can lead to a permanent avoidance of the pursuit.

But you are creating much more of a danger by preaching avoidance. You know that's been done forever, right? The Catholic Church has been preaching it for thousands of years. How has that worked out?

sam: You seem to reject an attraction to beauty. Is it only female beauty you reject or is it all beauty?

Ryan: You cannot choose not to be attracted to a beautiful member of the opposite sex, it is a law in nature, however, one can negate the temptation to play all the games to keep that beauty in your life over the long-term.

So, it's okay to be attracted to beauty but not to "play games" with it. Is this your argument?

[mansman]

I dont think the famous "Oneness" is about unity with people wether that is caring community or two mature spirital lovers in bed. If your plan is reduce vice and attachment, or end it some day, not good to indulge fantastic sensations in bed with woman, because this make goal harder to reach, even impossible. Because sex very strong effect on mind/body, also orgasm, how can you n0t "want more if you take just one"? Keep you trapped.
So I agree will pay to stay away not do if possible until desire fall off and not do become easier, natural, the new way with no suffering. Understand?
Sex yes strong but can be overcome like anything just need to make magic circumstance in your life that make more easy for you not think about the girls. Just like cold turkey work with cigarettes can also work with sex, but need special careful circumstances. Sure very difficult if everyday you watch TV, go to work with girls and have female friend.
If want to not be adict anymore can be done but success equal to determination.

So again dont be fool you that Oneness is joining with others or world or community or unity, Bullshit (as say Penn and Teller)! The Buddha Oneness something else, much different, nothing like anything you can find in the world. If your Oneness and meditation life is like anything else in the world you not find Buddha Oneness. This much I know.
If your world have colors, then no colors in Buddha Oneness.
If your world seem warm, then you feel nothing in Buddha Oneness.
If when pray your world still is around you, then not you find the Buddha Oneness.

Also say one writer must punish, we know can work for dumb animal types but of course not ideal, I hope we the world shoot higher than this for future! If punish someone best to have a goal in mind how you may advance crooked brother, just to punish for punishment sake is foolish approach. Mature people not need be punish, I know some myself act fine always as is. So aim for all to be grown up and wise, better consentrate here than crack whip all the time!

that all for now

[elderwoodxxx]

Well said!
amandaxxx

[BMcGilly07]

Celibacy is necessary to reach enlightenment. Neither of the two are for everyone, as most people live in realms other than the human realm (i.e. various other states of mind, such as animal, warring gods, starving ghosts... etc.). Anyone who wishes to be enlightened must first ignite the desire to be enlightened. Upon doing so, one will bring to mind the disparity between their current position and that of perfect enlightenment. The severe differences between one's current attached state and that of absolute freedom will bring about contempt, disgust and all manners of revulsion with the current state of affairs- which will ultimately allow for a rebirth in the human realm where one will begin to truly understand and suffer his attachments in the light of transient existence. Once he sees the fleeting nature of existence, he will recognize things for what they are. He will see the body not only as a temple, but as a bag of filth and pus, no longer a vehicle for his enjoyment. As his mind desires enlightenment, he will wish to know nothing short of the truth, and the nature of Ultimate Reality. The trappings of love- comfort, consolation, validation, affirmation, and so on, will be seen as the pitfalls along the path to enlightenment they are. If his own self is transient and ultimately nonexistent, how little satisfaction could be derived from another who is just as fleeting and ultimately nonexistent?

Note: edited comma placement, shortened sentence

[samadhi]

BM,

Celibacy is necessary to reach enlightenment.

I don't think so. Enlightenment is about who you are, not whether you are celibate or not.

The severe differences between one's current attached state and that of absolute freedom will bring about contempt, disgust and all manners of revulsion with the current state of affairs ...

Hatred is actually an emotional state that inhibits enlightenment. Contempt and disgust will keep you locked into your current state, acceptance is the gateway you are looking for.

He will see the body not only as a temple, but as a bag of filth and pus ...

The body is not a hindrance. When you see it as such, enlightenment recedes in the distance.

The trappings of love - comfort, consolation, validation, affirmation, and so on, will be seen as the pitfalls along the path to enlightenment they are ...

The pitfalls have to do with attachment; the emotions themselves are embraced for what they are, not attached to as who you are.

If his own self is transient and ultimately nonexistent, how little satisfaction could be derived from another who is just as fleeting and ultimately nonexistent?

Many require the help and guidance of a teacher. Anyone can be a teacher if you are willing to learn.

[elderwoodxxx]

It IS my experience here that none do learn from others.. they are too busy wrapped up in saying what is right or wrong, egos puffed i recall a phrase here ... truth IS everyone is right to their own personal understanding. Why cannot others simply ask what another exactly means.. for perceptions are infinte in truth. Understanding each other IS a key.

Amandaxxx

[samadhi]

It IS my experience here that none do learn from others...

Some do, some don't. Nothing unusual there.

... they are too busy wrapped up in saying what is right or wrong, egos puffed i recall a phrase here ...

Is there attachment here? Sure.

... truth IS everyone is right to their own personal understanding.

If you mean that people understand what they understand, that goes without saying.

Why cannot others simply ask what another exactly means.. for perceptions are infinte in truth. Understanding each other IS a key.

Those who are interested in understanding will ask. If they don't ask, they're not interested. Should they be interested? Why not let them decide?

[elderwoodxxx]

Of course others have their own will to decide what they will, but the point i was making is that most seem intent on pulling another down if their understanding is not the same as their own. Mockery abounds and reverberates off the walls here in cyberspace, there has been no other place like this that i have yet come across in this respect. Within mockery one is simply showing ignorance and conceit, self doubt and an attempt to belittle anothers worth. In casting aspersion words seem to get entangled in their own illusion of confusion. Perceptions are of course subjective and the foolish will enjoy casting yet more, deaf to much wisdom that may pass by.

Yes i was wrong to say that none do learn and of course you are right in this respect, we all will learn what we need to grow as we do indeed create our own experience to learn from. Some just learn quicker than others while some repeat the same in vain.

It is my experience here that so many seemingly conflicting viewpoints are actually misunderstood however, and if a little patience, considerstion and integrity with honour was shown then this forum may turn into some delightfully fruitful and wise converse. It would seem that in attempts to prove another wrong many are missing what would otherwise serve them well in understanding, of course these are my observations based upon my awareness of some of the dialect here.

Amandaxxx

[Alex Jacob]

Clear, direct prose that expressed concisely a group of thoughts that leave little doubt of what you are talking about. Also, a series of critical ideas that one can actually talk about. It is as if you have come down to earth and tread upon the earth!

Amanda! Yipee!

;-)

Humor, irony, 'mockery'---they are so much a part of the Western intellectual process! Even that boy-fondler Socrates engaged in incredibly acid comments, dripping with vicious irony. And you recently held him up as an example, n'est-ce pas? Someone wrote that that was more than likely the reason they put him to death: he offended some powerful people and they eliminated the little dirt-bagger. That and fucked their sons, which even in homoerotic Athens did not sit well with many men.

Humor and irony reverberates through our tradition, and I will venture to say that humor is Divine. But it depends too on what God you worship and what attributes you give to him. I think that Yeshua of the Bible narratives had an excellent sense of humor and ironic juxtaposition. 'Be as trusting as doves and wily as snakes' is one of my favorites. There is so much that can be read into that statement, and that maxim is relevant right here, right now.

I agree that from time to time underhanded humor gets out of control, but still what is gained from it is better than if it were absent.

"Within mockery one is simply showing ignorance and conceit, self doubt and an attempt to belittle anothers worth. In casting aspersion words seem to get entangled in their own illusion of confusion. Perceptions are of course subjective and the foolish will enjoy casting yet more, deaf to much wisdom that may pass by."

Not true, not true at all! Mockery and irony can indicate a surfeit of confidence, and also an authentic self-knowledge. It can also be offered in the spirit of empathy and compassion. But (I venture to say) what you want is a sort of Newage pablum. You'd happily accept oceans of platitudes over one probing or incisive comment, but you're in Penisville now baby, Vaginacity is over that way, down that delightful path by the pond with the frilly ferns and that delightful scent in the wind.

Okay, okay, here's a joke for you. Abe and Samuel are walking down the street and they see a sign that reads "Convert to Christianity and receive $500.00" Samuel says, "Hey, that's a lot of money, I'm going to go in and pretend I converted and get the cash!"

Abe says, "Great idea! We'll donate some money to the synagogue and spend Sunday in Coney Island!"

So, Samuel goes in and Abe waits outside...and waits, and waits, and waits. Three hours later Samuel comes and Abe asks him, "Nu? What happened?" and Samuel says laconically, "Well, I converted to Christianity". Then Abe asks him, "And the money?"

Samuel looks indignant, almost wounded, and screams, "Is that all you people think about!?"

Do people joke on your planet, Amanda?

[BMcGilly07]

BM: Celibacy is necessary to reach enlightenment.
Sam: I don't think so. Enlightenment is about who you are, not whether you are celibate or not.

Do you think that detachment is necessary for enlightenment?

BM: The severe differences between one's current attached state and that of absolute freedom will bring about contempt, disgust and all manners of revulsion with the current state of affairs ...
Sam: Hatred is actually an emotional state that inhibits enlightenment. Contempt and disgust will keep you locked into your current state, acceptance is the gateway you are looking for.

All emotional states inhibit enlightenment, but in order to break the bonds of love one must see attachments for what they are. Attachments are not disbanded by "being okay" with them or accepting them. One must garner a terrible resolve to unmask the ego's love of self, uncovering the writhing mass of worms beneath. If you do not hold the ego in contempt or if you are not disgusted by the needy selfishness of yourself, you have not realized the significance of what you have seen.

BM: He will see the body not only as a temple, but as a bag of filth and pus ...
Sam: The body is not a hindrance. When you see it as such, enlightenment recedes in the distance.

The body is indeed a hindrance to a great deal many of people, myself included. People do the stupidest things to keep in comfort, bed. A good deal of women, perhaps 90%, and a significant number of men lavish inordinate amounts of time and attention on their own physical beauty and other's.

From the compilation Evil Wisdom:

A famous athlete was making his triumphal entry into the city after another successful games. As he was carried along, he was unable to tear his eyes away from the many beautiful women among the onlookers.

"Look at our bave victor," remarked Diogenes, "taken captive by every girl he sees."

BM: The trappings of love - comfort, consolation, validation, affirmation, and so on, will be seen as the pitfalls along the path to enlightenment they are ...
Sam: The pitfalls have to do with attachment; the emotions themselves are embraced for what they are, not attached to as who you are.

Without staving off the emotions and returning to reason, one cannot differentiate emotions, or moods, and the attachments that evoke them.

BM: If his own self is transient and ultimately nonexistent, how little satisfaction could be derived from another who is just as fleeting and ultimately nonexistent?
Sam: Many require the help and guidance of a teacher. Anyone can be a teacher if you are willing to learn.

The only reason anyone can be a teacher if you're willing to learn is reason.