Language Mavens, your assistance is requested

[xerosaburu]

Is it true to say that two things may be the same without being identical?

I say yes for a number of reasons.

First, same is a like comparison such that thing A being compared to thing B in the manner of evaluative content so that one may say the same thing, such as "No" in more than one way. To say "No" and to say "Forget it" or to say "Is the bear catholic?" are the same, however they are not identical.

Identicalness has to do with form and substance whereas the former has to do with substance.

There are, of course cases where two answers may be identical, but far from the same, such as when a woman says "No" and a man says "No", the man will invariably have the substance content of "No" whereas the woman just may have the substance content of "Yes" when the outward form is "No".

In these cases just use the Magic Eight Ball.

Cool

But seriously, what say you?

Another thing is that identical and same are different in various programming languages such as java such that two things may be identical because they point to the same thing and so they have the same value by virtue of being the same identical thing as a matter of existence, whereas a subclassed thing may be identical in form and content in one manner, whereas not identical at all because what we've done is asked the questions of existence with regard to identity and sameness so that Person A who has a penny in his pocket is not the same or identical to his Clone B who likewise has a penny in his pocket.

At the metalevel these two just discussed are the same and identical while at a deeper level are in fact neither the same nor are they identical.

Does that make sense?

[Relo]

Another thing is that identical and same are different in various programming languages such as java such that two things may be identical because they point to the same thing and so they have the same value by virtue of being the same identical thing as a matter of existence, whereas a subclassed thing may be identical in form and content in one manner, whereas not identical at all because what we've done is asked the questions of existence with regard to identity and sameness so that Person A who has a penny in his pocket is not the same or identical to his Clone B who likewise has a penny in his pocket.

At the metalevel these two just discussed are the same and identical while at a deeper level are in fact neither the same nor are they identical.

Does that make sense?

Yes it does, even to the side of a identity of comparison to an ego. The first time a child wins they're basketball game was great to feel considering the child hasn't experienced it much at all and is brough to it for the first time, thus making it more exciteable and worth the playing of the sport.

Of course you can compare identity and being the same to not only ego perspectives but to culture and all others that you can bring up just as well.

You can easily compare that win to a win of a college basketball player. Yes the played wins and they do get satisfaction out of the game, even a bit of money on the side, but the original factor to why they went into the sport can the primary factor just as said as above, like the first time the college student stepped on to the court when he/she was young.

In ego perspective, people could naturally say that the college game was a greater win personally for the ones who par-took in the event based on age difference and what not, but I'm sure the college player would agree without ego involved that he could remember exact details of his first moment of win and excitement quite easily compared to the win he just experienced. It's almost as if the games he plays today is an attempt to re-live that original joy he felt when he/she was young.

So comparing one game to another in general only given the observer the detail that there were two games, one involving a younger player who is just starting out, and the other involving the older player who has had a healthy amount of experience, they can yes, be identical without being the same, even though I switched around your stating question.