Should I stay or should I go?

[Kevin Solway]

Laird, your above post has nothing to do with the purpose of this forum but is all about yourself. If your posts had something to do with the stated purpose of this forum I'm sure David wouldn't be asking you to move on.

[Elizabeth Isabelle]

Keven, surely you must realize that it is exceptionally difficult for someone with an ego - like Laird - to make it about the community when he is personally on the chopping block.

If nothing else, I do think that this thread is extremely psychologically insightful into the exact point of dislodging the ego as a step to "enlightenment."

Perhaps with this, Laird will now see what you are talking about.

[David Quinn]

That's ironic because David's actions amount to trying to make this place more communal. He's the one trying to force a common mindset. If, as is often said around here, philosophy is really, deeply, about individuals, then Laird should be seen and treated as just another individual on GF. He shouldn't be treated any differently and the admins should be very cautious in using their powers in ways that elevate them above the other individuals here.

Reading the "Introduction and Explanation" section of the forum I can't help but think that David is contravening the forum's charter. You need to change it, maybe you should include a disclaimer like "*despite all the talk of fearless bloody no rules discussion expounded upon above, David Quinn reserves the right to remove members whose views he disagrees with."

I appreciate your concerns. Ideally, I would prefer not to do this sort of thing, but sometimes it is necessary.

There are two competing issues at play here. On the one hand, there is the issue of freedom of speech and allowing everyone the desire to do what they want on the forum, and on the other, the issue of keeping enlightenment, wisdom, truth, etc, at the forefront of the forum's collective consciousness. Sometimes, these two issues clash.

There has never been complete freedom here. For example, we have always had a policy of banning trolls from the forum, emoticons are disabled, graphics are deleted, personal chit-chat is strongly discouraged, etc, all of which which are designed to maintain forum focus. I would argue that Laird falls into the category of a troll, although I realize that many here would disagree with that. It is my own personal judgment and I stand by it. Being an admin, I am compelled to take responsibility for that judgment and act upon it.

I accept that many people here will probably have a bad taste in their mouths over what I have done, but there is nothing I can do about that. It is my opinion that the forum will benefit in the long run.

-

[spelnxpert]

My first impulse was to condemn the idea of expelling someone, but Laird, when you think about it objectively, isn't it true you were like some person in a classroom disagreeing continuously with the instructor and repeatedly making him justify himself and his methods and his beliefs and his information as so on and so on....seriously Laird what, if anything could a teacher accomplish in such an place?

So you've made your point, repeatedly, you've had your say, you've even caused a fair amount of distraction and disruption from the moderators perspective, which I suppose you could look at as a sort of mission accomplished for yourself. B/c, if you could have it your way, wouldn't you like it if this instruction and these QRSH ideas were not hitting the mark, were not changing and convincing and aligning people with these self-proclaimed sages?
Be proud then, of being booted out, and plot a new strategy for whence you return.

As far as engaging with like minded people here goes, it's just a matter of setting this up yourself on a similar forum, do that and take others with you if you want. You may find eventually unlike-minded people joining you and challenging you there, and you can make rules that seem better to you too, or no rules at all if you prefer.

So don't be sore and don't act impulsively or bother with retribution, don't waste your time or your energy, try to remember that in the moderators mind he really believes this is best for you and for others, even though he may be wrong.
And if the person who invited you in is now inviting you out too, surely, no harm could be intended.

[hsandman]

My first impulse was to condemn the idea of expelling someone, but Laird, when you think about it objectively, isn't it true you were like some person in a classroom disagreeing continuously with the instructor and repeatedly making him justify himself and his methods and his beliefs and his information as so on and so on

and so on, and so on...mixing up analogies...
discussion(A conversation or debate about a topic.)
forum (A place of meeting or medium for an exchange of views)...
class(A system that divides members of a society into sets based on social or economic status.)-
room(A space enclosed by walls) ...
Learn the meaning of things you are spelling genius.

....seriously Laird what, if anything could a teacher accomplish in such an place?

Seriously? Were you speaking in jest before? A teacher in such a place would achieve understanding as apposed to indoctrination by monologue.

As far as engaging with like minded people here goes, it's just a matter of setting this up yourself on a similar forum, do that and take others with you if you want. You may find eventually unlike-minded people joining you and challenging you there, and you can make rules that seem better to you too, or no rules at all if you prefer.

Sort of virtual exodus to the promised land. Read between the lines -Mosus said... Let's go to where apples grow wild.

try to remember that in the moderators mind he really believes this is best for you and for others, even though he may be wrong.

People are full of bullshit, especially teachers/sages/superiors/parents/priests and other so called “Authorities” and "Betters".. and you are gullible fool for not questioning them deeply and thoroughly when your impulses compel you. (Impulses are = instincts that our forebears developed over millions of years of survival) Enlightenment is a journey, not a destination, while following blindly the heard of "betters",and not paying attention you are missing it.

And if the person who invited you in is now inviting you out too, surely, no harm could be intended.

"Harmless uninviting" Hehe, good one! You have talent at rationalizing injustice. When you finish school and grow up, you want to be in Public Relations, right? Well, think about it anyway.

Cheerio. :-)

[David Quinn]

You may have missed that spelnxpert was being sarcastic.

-

[hsandman]

You may have missed that spelnxpert was being sarcastic.

Oh..
To paraphrase her post with this song.
HSM 2 - Humuhumunukunukuapua'a (chipmunk version)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aAXp_gj_YGg
Expertly done. Bravo.
lol

[David Quinn]

GF is not a community. I can't emphasise this enough because it is quintessentially important.

--Rowden

It is what any community does that possesses values.

--Quinn

It isn't a forum for socializing and wiling away the time, as in the case of Olio. It is a collection of individuals who value philosophy and spiritual development.

-

[Lydiia Knightjoy]

It is a collection of individuals who value philosophy and spiritual development.

Thanks for clarifying that Dan's emphatic statement that this is not a community and your implication that this is a community is not a contradiction because it is really a "collection of individuals".

It isn't a forum for socializing and wiling away the time, as in the case of Olio.

So, you freely admit, then, that the Olio forum is more important than this er, um, "collection of individuals".

By the way, one of your "geniuses" seems to keep "wiling away the time" at Olio. I won't mention any names, but his initials start with "Dan Rowden", but I'm sure you've spent a little time there yourself based on your comprehensive knowledge of it. Unless, of course, you are able to acquire such knowledge through divine means.

[Dan Rowden]

There's merit in knowing your enemy.

[David Quinn]

It is a collection of individuals who value philosophy and spiritual development.

Thanks for clarifying that Dan's emphatic statement that this is not a community and your implication that this is a community is not a contradiction because it is really a "collection of individuals".

It isn't a social community of friends in the way that Laird wanted it to be.

I'm sure you see the point that Dan and I are making. It isn't hard.

-

[hsandman]

[quote=Alex]With all my heart, and from the depths of my heart, to all I offer a most beautiful story. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bgkxSSQbGsI[/quote]

Thank you. That is soul music. (Is that a dirty/inane word? I missed the memo. heh)

At which she turned her head away
Great tears leaping from her eyes
I could not wipe the smile from my face
As I sat sadly by her side. :-)

Nick Cave - As I Sat Sadly By Her Side
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=__MOjSyLgNc

[Dan Rowden]

Seriously, are you pissed or high when you post? Either way, stop.

[hsandman]

-Dan-

Seriously, are you pissed or high when you post?

-Seriously-

Dan, I, suspect that was directed at me? If my short term memory recalls this correctly, I was "high", when I posted that. Right now I am little high and pissed. Sometimes, I do post when I am... sober and low. (Kind of like you are now.)
If you want more detailed info on my posting habits, just ask, and I will make pie chart for you, and post a link to it, with annotated explanation of the contents in the link.

-Dan-
Either way, stop.

-Seriously-

Either way. Yes!/endsarcasm. Hahahah.

Ps. Seriously. Do you have any more requests? ;-)

[Steven]

What harm has a voice? If I don't ignore you that is my decision, not yours.

[Lydiia Knightjoy]

What harm has a voice?

Insults and taunting harm only children (and child-like adults, of which I am one). However, a voice whispering sexy messages can lead astray even some of the most stoic among us. Cults have been seducing otherwise intelligent people with messages of Enlightenment for centuries. If those selling the idea were truly Enlightened, voices of dissent wouldn't hurt them in the least.

[Sapius]

What harm has a voice?

Insults and taunting harm only children (and child-like adults, of which I am one). However, a voice whispering sexy messages can lead astray even some of the most stoic among us. Cults have been seducing otherwise intelligent people with messages of Enlightenment for centuries. If those selling the idea were truly Enlightened, voices of dissent wouldn't hurt them in the least.

True, but all one can see are the words and actions, and from that one cannot truly know another individual’s real motivation behind them, for they are totally dependent on the totality of ones mindset and personal values, and each individual is unique in that regard.

So, one could never really know if those voices hurt another individual personally. At best, it will always remain a projection as seen through my own values.

[Jason]

Has Laird been banned?

[Tomas]

Has Laird been banned?

-Laird writes-
In case I am banned, anyone who wants to stay in contact with me can reach me via email. My address is lairdshaw at dodo dot com dot au.

-tomas-
He is permitted (free) to lurk, his account is active (see avatar).

Sounds somewhat "voluntary" to me.


.

[maestro]

Jason your avatar is hilarious.

[samadhi]

That's funny, I was thinking the same thing!

[Jason]

Stick around there's more avatar hijinks to come. :)

[Jason]

Ok, David is Laird banned?

[David Quinn]

He was banned a couple of weeks ago.

-

[Dan Rowden]

Laird has established a new "home" for himself, which he will find more homely than this place, with the lads at Olio: http://olio80114.yuku.com/forums/35

You can catch up with him there if you feel so inclined.