Question for the intellectually mature.

[Carl G]

Katy: Really? I've heard "fake it 'till you make it" repeatedly... mostly out of the church who keep telling me that if I pretend to be like Christ in my actions eventually my thoughts will follow. Having never tried it, I don't know if it works.

EI: I imagine that you didn't try it because the people who told you that weren't like Christ. Furthermore, you probably realize that being a Katy is far better then being a parrot Christ. Seriously, Christ wasn't a parrot Christ, so why should anyone else be?

To Katy:

if I pretend to be like Christ in my actions eventually my thoughts will follow. Having never tried it, I don't know if it works.

It does work. It works with Christ-likeness, it works in business, it works. It is not really a matter of pretending, though. It is more about becoming, one step at a time.


To ExpectantlyIronic:

you probably realize that being a Katy is far better then being a parrot Christ.

After clearing out your cynicism and faulty definition, you might agree that being an E.I. is not far better than being a E.I. who is becoming a Christ.

Seriously, Christ wasn't a parrot Christ, so why should anyone else be?

If you refer to Jesus, how do you know he wasn't still working on becoming the Christ? Was he entirely perfect?

[ExpectantlyIronic]

Carl,

You're stunned because you jumped to the wrong conclusion, then had an emotional reaction based on your false definition, which clouded your reason.

I didn't have a false definition of anything (whatever that means). I took your usage of "then being" to be applicable to "those in real life who are more astute than you". Which it was. So you did say "[be] those in real life who are more astute than you". Which I disagree with. If all you meant to say was "learn from other people" then I shouldn't disagree, but that wasn't at all clear from what you said. It is quite different to learn from someone, then to attempt to be them. If you are trying to be someone, then it follows that you aren't putting your own creative spin on what you're doing, and intelligence requires a great deal of creativity.

After clearing out your cynicism and faulty definition, you might agree that being an E.I. is not far better than being a E.I. who is becoming a Christ.

I already am what I want to be. If being a Christ (whatever that is) is different from being me, then I can't imagine why I'd want to be it. That which I do is done for fun or out of necessity. If we are to consider a Christ to be me who can throw a wicked fastball, then that'd be cool to be, but not to become. I don't find the process of learning to throw a wicked fastball to be overly fun, so to be me becoming such a Christ would be far inferior to being me.

If you refer to Jesus, how do you know he wasn't still working on becoming the Christ? Was he entirely perfect?

I don't know what you mean to suggest by the term "perfect".

[Katy]

If you had time, money, and three months to become as smart as possible - what would your schedule be like...I'm serious, try to invent a peak your intelligence boot camp type of program...

I don’t know that the question really makes sense. As smart as possible in 3 months?. I can tell you the three months which most dramatically affected me; I cannot tell you what to do.
I left the country, and anything familiar and comfortable and traveled. I didn’t go many of the places that tourists usually go, though I hit a few. War (or rather war memorials such as the killing fields), homelessness, orphanages, South African townships… whatever. I could list lessons I learned, but they wouldn’t mean anything to you, or at least they wouldn’t mean the same things to you.

In the forward to Twilight of the Idols Nietzsche wrote that war is good in that the wounds cause people to think. He went on to say that continuously finding idols was also important… in other words, you need the system shock to start looking for intelligence – but it is not enough. I suppose if one had 3 months to live and wanted to become as wise as possible, intentionally putting themselves in place to get that system shock would be my recommendation – but by itself it is not enough.

I appreciate that as much as I appreciate a bum sitting beside me on the subway...

And here’s another good place to start. Why don’t you appreciate a bum sitting beside you on the subway? Why do you use the word bum to begin with, rather than homeless person? What prejudices in your mind does this demonstrate? What delusions cause you to use this as a reference?

[Jamesh]

And here’s another good place to start. Why don’t you appreciate a bum sitting beside you on the subway? Why do you use the word bum to begin with, rather than homeless person? What prejudices in your mind does this demonstrate? What delusions cause you to use this as a reference?

for me, because they stink, is as good an answer as any other. Their smell produces negative emotions in one's mind.

Nothing wrong with this point of view, it is rational.

[MindExpansion]

Jamesh got the hole in one...But yes Katy I should not call homeless people bums. I remember my friend once stole an unopened bottle of vodka from a homeless person. How do you think that may have affected the already drunken mans life. We may have saved his life or ended it...He must have spent all day collecting change. After we drank, I felt especially depressed:(

What are other websites and books that would be useful on my journey to mental clarity?

[grandnux]

I would suggest that you read the book written by Todd Siler
which is titled "Think Like a Genius."
He discusses the concept of symbolic modeling in a way that could even help people with average intellect think in a more useful and creative way.
Always remember that Genius is 1% inspiration and 99% perspiration (according to Thomas Edison).
Nothing comes easy; however, it can be obtained if you really want it..
food for thought....

[MindExpansion]

According to multiple IQ tests I'm in the top 5% minority of the
population...I may not write clearly, or intelligently, but that does not reflect one' thoughts. Oh, you beg to differ? Well your right no matter what you say! words do not play a large role in my thoughts; Pictures/symbols/moving, changing images do...And no I'm not retarded...How dare you spite that filth in my direction...

Back to the topic please. The more we use it the stronger it gets similar to a muscle, yet totally different.

I understand 'it' does not improve over night. What is the right way of studying, what if I only improve thinking patterns that aren crooked...I want a clean computer, with the most up to date and efficient OS.

I need guidance I don't want to study a lot only to later realize my epiphanies are faulty...

[Gretchen]

I need guidance I don't want to study a lot only to later realize my epiphanies are faulty...

ME, Dan may sound flippant, but in his own way he is telling you the truth. Start with the sentence above. Exercise your mind.

Answer these questions:

1. Why do you think you need guidance?
2. Why do you think anyone here can give you guidance?
3. If you don't study, what else will you do?
4. Why don't you want to study?
5. Is there anything inherently wrong with being unwise?
6. Why do you want to be wise?
7. What are your epiphanies, in general?
8. Are these epiphanies really real or are you delusional?
9. Why does IQ mean so much to you?
10. Why do you think thoughts are more important than writing clearly or intelligently?

The list could go on and on. No one can build on Socrates because he was the consummate inquisitor...it is hard to find absolutes, if you do, you must learn to question and test them. You've found the right place, so start arguing your position - there are plenty of people here (although I am not one of them) who can knock your position out of the box. Humility is a great learning tool.

Good Luck!

[brokenhead]

MindExpansion wrote:

To put it bluntly, what must I read, study, exercise in order to peak my intelligence.

The Urantia Book. I believe it's public domain now. Give it time, you don't read it, you read at it. It's not like anything else. You use it like a whetstone to sharpen your mind. Don't let the other yahoos on this forum brow-beat you out of it, most of them never even heard of it, and if 5% of the memberlist have ever even tried to read it, I'll eat my hat.

And for amusement, Gurdjieff's Beelzebub's Tales to His Grandson. Nothing like the Sufic tradition to put a cut in your strut, pep in your step, and glide back in your stride.

[Shahrazad]

Don't let the other yahoos on this forum brow-beat you out of it, most of them never even heard of it, and if 5% of the memberlist have ever even tried to read it, I'll eat my hat.

Broken, you are hilarious.

[DHodges]

The Urantia Book.

I recall running across The Urantia Book in a library, back around 1985. I picked it up and glanced through it, curious that there could be such a huge book about something that, from the title, I didn't even know what it was about.

I was amazed. 2000 pages of incoherent ramblings. Why was this written? Why was it published? What was it doing in a college library?

At the time I thought of it as a bizarre anomaly, perhaps the result of some strange mix of obsessive-compulsive disorder with schizophrenia. Perhaps they studied it in a psychology class.

Over time, I have been forced, again and again, to see that some people really think like that - maybe most people. It's not that different from the Bible or the Book of Mormon.

If you like that sort of thing, I would suggest instead The Book of the SubGenius.

But The Urantia Book is online, so you can judge for yourself if it is worthwhile (hint: it's not).

[brokenhead]

Yahoo #1 has been heard from.

[brokenhead]

DHodges wrote:

It's not that different from the Bible or the Book of Mormon.

That makes three books he hasn't read.

How can the UB be "not that different" from 2 very different books?


He also wrote:

I picked it up and glanced through it, curious that there could be such a huge book about something that, from the title, I didn't even know what it was about.

I was amazed. 2000 pages of incoherent ramblings. Why was this written? Why was it published? What was it doing in a college library?

The UB is almost excruciatingly coherent and consistent. That is, if you, say, READ it.

You did pose three questions in the above quote. Here are the answers. 1. To be read. 2. So people could read it. 3. To make it possible for people to read it.

Hey listen, I hated War and Peace until I read it.

[brokenhead]

And don't worry, DHodges, I got your back, bro, I'm in Philly too. We're in for a long summer---the bullpen's gonna sink the Phillies.

[brokenhead]

I need guidance I don't want to study a lot only to later realize my epiphanies are faulty...

MindExpansion, you can't be afraid to make mistakes or you'll never learn anything. Read everything, just be critical. Your head will crap out the shit it doesn't need, trust me. There is a breathtaking consistency in ideas that matter. Don't be afraid to think with your heart, either, it helps you recognize the ring of truth when you hear it.

[DHodges]

How can the UB be "not that different" from 2 very different books?

They are all in the category of religious nonsense. (IMHO.) There are people that claim the Koran is consistent, too. I don't really care if it is or not; I have no intention of reading it. It gets thrown on the same pile with the Torah and the rest, as far as I'm concerned.

If I recall correctly - and I admit I'm pretty vague on this point - the Urantia people claim it was dictated by some alien being, or something like that. Or was Jesus an alien? (Or is that Scientology?)

Hey listen, I hated War and Peace until I read it.

Hey, I actually read that one!

And don't worry, DHodges, I got your back, bro, I'm in Philly too.

Well, that's a relief. If I'm ever in trouble, I'll just send up the brokenhead signal, and you'll come screeching up in the brokenheadmobile to save the day!

[Nordicvs]

What studies and intellectual strain must one pursue in order to exploit ones' cogitive potential.

To put it bluntly, what must I read, study, exercise in order to peak my intelligence.

If you are capable to respond with thoroughly, thank you.

Everything you can---but branch out. History - anthropology - archeology; Biology - paleobiology - exobiology; physics - metaphysics - psychology; and such. Philosophy is like a hub, I think, for knowledge.

Also, I think a periodic digressionist approach is essential.

[brokenhead]

Well, that's a relief. If I'm ever in trouble, I'll just send up the brokenhead signal, and you'll come screeching up in the brokenheadmobile to save the day!

All I ask is that you use the signal judiciously.

[MindExpansion]

Is their anything else?

[Unidian]

I recommend examining the content of your own questions..

I'm with Dan here. "Know thyself" - it ain't just a slogan. Look at the underlying assumptions, beliefs, and desires hidden in the questions you ask yourself and others. Question those hidden aspects, and then look at what is behind those questions. Keep doing this until you have no more philosophical questions and nothing further arises. This is as good a place to start as any, and certainly better than a university classroom or someone else's preferred reading list.

There's plenty of time to learn quotes, passages, names, dates, sutras, terms, and all of that. First, learn how to think all the way to the end of thinking. If you do that, the rest is cake - optional, even.

I don't know if this will increase your IQ, but who cares?

[Unidian]

BTW, The Urantia Book is nonsense. While I concede it might be possible for certain people to sharpen their thinking skills though nonsense, most of us would be well-advised not to overdo it. Zen koans and aphorisms are a better route to this anyway. And if you want Sufi mysticism, go to the authentic source and read Al-Arabi rather than Gurdjieff.

[MindExpansion]

I think one of my problems is that it's hard for me to make up my mind (guess it's a problem with organization). There so, so many sides to an argument, should I just guess a conclusion and work on explaining it?

I ask a lot of questions, even though I may be convinced of the answer...

thanks, now all I have to do is copy every tip down:)

[Katy]

well, no. Starting with a conclusion isn't likely very helpful. Maybe you just need more organization though. Like when you start thinking on something use paper or whatever to organize each different side of it instead of letting them become jumbled.

[MindExpansion]

Maybe thats why there are volumes and volumes written to explain these topics...Which I have not read!

The leaps I make in reasoning are rational, its the the written part seems to mean a different meaning to me then to others. Sort of like in life, people do not understand me unless I pretend to be someone else.

AND NO I don't think I'm a genius...Far from it, Thats how I found this site (by looking up "how to become a genius" and such...lol)
(I was bored...)
........................................................................................

I'll just leave it at that!

[Jason]

AND NO I don't think I'm a genius...Far from it, Thats how I found this site (by looking up "how to become a genius" and such...lol)
(I was bored...)
........................................................................................

I'll just leave it at that!

You really need to understand something before you continue: this forum is not about "genius" in the conventional sense of the word. It is not about the stereotypical Albert Einsteins of the world with their massive intellects and/or IQs.

This forum is primarily about philosophy and truth.

If you haven't already, I suggest you read the "Welcome and Introduction" section of this forum which outlines what the forum is concerned with:
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