Sympathy and hatred - yes and no

[Cory Duchesne]

I've noticed that one finds oneself continually invited by other people to partake in activities that one would rather not do.

Marriages, funerals, family gatherings, parties, are the more common sort of activities that I dread.

Occasionally the invitations that one gets are very idiosyncratic.

There is this really overweight severely depressed girl that often calls me and asked me to go over to her house. She is hopelessly stunted intellectually, very homely, is on the highest dose of anti-depressent med you can be on, and she is obssessed with achieving sexual experiences with whoever will succomb to her insistence.

Most of the time I dont answer the phone when she calls because I just can't bear the repetitiveness and the squalor of her being. I feel bad about this. There is a desire to help her - -- but I just dont see how I can. Speaking to her about philosopohical and psychological matters doesnt seem to help her. she continues to eat poorly, dwell on sexual fantasies, make sexual suggestions, and make plans for the future that involve me and her doing various activities. She constantly wants promises, and no ammount of philosophizing with her changes her. She just nods her head and goes along with what I am saying, and then, the next time I talk to her, she is dwelling on the same mundane things she was when I first starting dealing with her. Is sympathy an indication that one is unenightened?

The problem with this sort of sympathy is that it drives you to sacrifice yourself and give your self to the dreams of other people.

When actions are born out of sympathy you allow yourself to submit to and be used by the desires of people who dont value truth, but rather, value only their most base desires.

I have acted out of sympathy before, and I come out of it feeling bitter and resentful.

Is that why humanity is so full of hatred and violence?

Because they are sympathetic and submissive to the desires of those who dont value truth?

[DHodges]

There is this really overweight severely depressed girl that often calls me and asked me to go over to her house. She is hopelessly stunted intellectually, very homely, is on the highest dose of anti-depressent med you can be on, and she is obssessed with achieving sexual experiences with whoever will succomb to her insistence.

How about this. Say to her, "Tell you what. I'll have sex with you when you lose 30 pounds." Then, whenever she brings up sex, ask her how she's doing with her weight.

Pretty soon, she'll leave you alone.

In the unlikely event that she actually does drop the 30 pounds (insist on a weigh-in), you do her once and make her lose another 30.

[Cory Duchesne]

Dhodges,

How about this. Say to her, "Tell you what. I'll have sex with you when you lose 30 pounds." Then, whenever she brings up sex, ask her how she's doing with her weight.

[laughs]

That sounds like a somewhat intelligent way of dealing with her -

Hence, it is a bit brutal.

I would have a hard time suggesting this plan to her, because I anticipate that she would be very hurt by it. She has a tendency to fool herself into thinking she is desirable sexually. Extereme wishful thinking. To confront the fact of her own weight problem and unattractiveness is probably what drives her to the anti-dep-meds. The junk food she eats while sitting in front of the television is her only solace. Plus, even if she did lose 30 pounds, I'm really not interested in having sex. She's had sex with alot of sordid men, so there is also the risk of disease. So I'd also have to suggest she get tested for disease.

My sympathy does not want to go through with it.

Is intelligence, wisdom, clarity - -divorced from sympathy? If that's the case - - my wisdom is most certainly not at all constant.

So do you agree? Is sympathy a weakness?

In order to be kind, must we hurt peoples feelings (be cruel), by brining to peoples attention the sort of things that they are trying to escape from through their desire to be friends? Or even abandoning them altogether?

It seems intelligence is beyond cruelty and kindness, yet is both of them. Perhaps this is a definition for 'goodness'?

Anyways, I actually just got off the phone with her. I was feeling kind of miserable before talking with her. Now that I'm done talking with her I feel good. I never really said anything, asked a few questions and just listened to her. She behaved herself for once, however, as usually she dwelled on her psychological problems and fears....I made no suggestions, I just listened -- and it was she who let me go. anyway, now that the phone conversation is over, I actually feel quite comforatable inwardly - but it wasnt related to any particular comment she said. she never said anything positive, nor did I.

Odd.

[Creative Fossil]

Deffinately sympathising this personality type is NOT helping her

she feeds off your sympathy, it encourages her to continue with it, her malaise draws your attention and that is what she seeks, so she keeps up the malaise.

some people do actually enjoy being miserable if you can understand that contracdiction!

I myself have 'divorced' myself from people like this when I have seen that I have been no help to them and their mood is bringing me down. And guess what? Without me feeding their negative energy they buck their ideas up and improve! Typical!

If you ignore any type of negative behaviour it ceases, they apply this logic to parenting! It works!

[Creative Fossil]

Oh and with regard to your question about enlightenment, i would suggest giving sympathy and enlightenment are not related. Enlightenment means realising that u are a 'worm' in the grand scheme of things. ie very very insignificant and small, a detail!

[DHodges]

So do you agree? Is sympathy a weakness?

It's weak to do the short-term thing, give her sympathy to make her feel better for the moment, when she really needs a good smack in the head. She is wallowing in delusion. You are doing nothing to help her. The only thing that will really help her is to actually deal with her problems, instead of pretending they don't exist.

You need to be direct and honest. If not for her sake, then for your own.

[Diebert van Rhijn]

Hence, it is a bit brutal.....I would have a hard time suggesting this plan to her, because I anticipate that she would be very hurt by it.

What you call sympathy here seems only a front, a justification, to hide your own dependency on her (or your) emotional state.

Is that why humanity is so full of hatred and violence?

Because they are sympathetic and submissive to the desires of those who dont value truth?

I think it's because they're ignorant of the forces that drive them and so keep on lying unconsciously, covering up the bitter truths about their behavior. The discomfort must be killing them at some point.

[Cory Duchesne]

Diebert wrote:

What you call sympathy here seems only a front, a justification, to hide your own dependency on her (or your) emotional state.

I hardly ever see her or talk to her. I've actually kept myself quite distant in order to prevent much emotional involvement.

I think this quote by Chang Tzu explains my position:

"Be careful ‑ don't meddle with people's minds! People's minds can be forced down or boosted up, but this downing and upping imprisons the mind and brings death to it.

Gentle and shy, the mind can bend the hard and strong; it can chisel and cut away, carve and polish. Its heat is that of burning fire, its coldness that of solid ice, its swiftness such that, in the time it takes to lift and lower the head, it has twice swept over the four seas and beyond. At rest, it is deep‑fathomed and still; in movement, it is far‑flung as the heavens, racing and galloping out of reach of all bonds. This indeed is the mind of man!"
---------------------------------
My Sympathy wants to make suggestions to her, it wants to give her hopes, to give her aims, to give her a plan to improve. But my sympathy can only cause mischief.

My understanding is what acts, and thus I do nothing. When she calls, I don't answer. Sometimes I do. And when I do, I listen, suggestionless, occasionally posing a question and reponding to hers, usually with another question.

[SBN Charles]

Is it not that your mind is bound to this woman? cut this bond and you shall be free from her straining your conscience!

Why did you allow relations to continue to occur in the first place?

Didn't it strike you she needed help when you saw how large she was? refer her to a professional and be done with it.

hope that helps Cory, good luck!

[La Verdad]

There is this really overweight severely depressed girl that often calls me and asked me to go over to her house. She is hopelessly stunted intellectually, very homely, is on the highest dose of anti-depressent med you can be on, and she is obssessed with achieving sexual experiences with whoever will succomb to her insistence.

tell her to stick a fork in the electrical outlet. Everyone wins. Hell even Commonwealth Edison probably makes a few extra pennies :P

So do you agree? Is sympathy a weakness?

"Mann verliert Kraft wenn Mann mitleidet." - Friedrich Nietzsche
"Man loses strength/energy when he sympathizes."

[Kevin Solway]

Once you know what your purpose in life is, then you'll know what to do.

[LooF]

she can only cure herself

maybe you can help it

[MKFaizi]

Well, she has problems other than her obesity. Of course, many problems do melt away with the pounds.

If you really wanted to "help" her, I think the sex for pounds might be a good plan. That is, if you really want to do that. Also, if she did start to lose the weight.

Of course, that sort of thing can backfire. You could find out that she is not as brainless as you have thought. Plus, once she loses the weight, you might find out she is a "babe" and she'll dump you.

Faizi