Meditation & Desire

[NobodyListens2Genius]

I’ve always wondered what it is about people that lead them to act, almost always, against their own benefit. Now, the first and most obvious answer that I came across, was simply that we are ignorant to what is best for us. But, after realizing that even when one is aware of the right path, or the right choice, they are still easily, and even knowingly lead astray. I found that people hold within themselves an insatiable thirst. As if they are endlessly searching for fulfillment of a shortcoming they can’t even name.

Every human experiences this feeling. It is this universal longing that is often confused for other desires, the desire for wealth, the desire for acceptance from others, the desire to be comfortable with ourselves, and even the desire for purpose. But this is simply a distraction, a confusion. A futile attempt to answer this longing.. Chasing after these things, even if they are attained, does not satisfy the being. You cannot quench desire, at least not for very long. The more we give into our wants, and the more we continue to feed our desires, the stronger they return, and the higher our standards for satisfaction become. If you were wealthy last year, you will not be satisfied with only scraping by the next. Simply put, the more we chase after what we want, the more we want. Now this may not be clear at first, but what we are really longing for is to return to the source.


What this means is that we are longing to feel that where we are right now is where we ought to be, that what we are doing is what we ought to be doing, and that we lack for nothing. How then is it possible to achieve this contentment? To rid ourselves of this longing? Surely there can be no place we would want to stay forever, and I cannot imagine something that I would want to do forever. The only way to satisfy our being, to feel long lasting contentment in our lives is to alter our perception.

If we continue to name things beautiful, we will find other things ugly. If we continue to chase after company, other times we will be lonely. If we prefer a certain temperature, we will even feel uncomfortable going outside. The higher we raise our standards and our expectations, the more we will be disappointed and feel that we are lacking. Thus comes the ancient saying, “If you want to be given everything, you must first give everything up.”

Free yourself from concepts and plans. Leave behind you’re desires, they will only hold you back. Forget the favored sensual experience; it will only dull all other experiences. What is the difference between hearing a yes or a no? Do you have to act like everybody else? Do you have to want the same things that they want, and avoid the same things that they avoid? Leaving aside physical pain, if you have never been homeless or starving, then every other negative feeling that you have ever had, has come solely from within your own mind, all these are illusions that arise from the ego, from the false sense of separation that we feel, all separation arises from naming. Particular things did not exist before we created names and starting separating them. Once we can accept the reality of oneness, and stop distinguishing and preferring, we can let things come and go without attachment or judgment, then we will be free from suffering. So then how do you feel that you are where you ought to be? Accept wherever life takes you. The moment you realize that you have enough, you will be truly rich.

Some wisdom sourced from the Tao Te Ching by Lao Tzu.

[Cathy Preston]

Very nice, such a relief from the standard love is all there is.

[Eric Orwoll]

I think people fall into the trap of desire because they construct an identity around what they lack. Lifestyles are rarely constructed to celebrate our abilities, they're usually created to make us aware of our shortcomings.
The runner strives for the next record time, not for the act itself.
The musician practices unceasingly to develop new artistry, not to allow their mind to play.
The businessman sets his sights on the next trade, not on the pile of wealth lying behind him.

The explanation is simple. Evolution favored those who would not stop seeking.
We are, all of us, the descendants of those who engaged in the will to power.

The concept of a self that is worth protecting and seeking gains for turned out to be a very useful belief for survival.

To undo the predisposition of our machinery and detach from identification with our limits is a worthy goal. But what do you use to replace that which you seek to overturn?

Enlightenment can leave a sense of purposelessness. I've found it useful to replace the fulfillment of desire with a sense of authorship over life.

Rather then allowing desire to direct what you out to pull out of the external world, view the world as a canvas on which to place the art of your life.

[NobodyListens2Genius]

Rather then allowing desire to direct what you out to pull out of the external world, view the world as a canvas on which to place the art of your life.

I liked that Eric. I agree about the sense of purposelessness or disinterest and went through a time where I wasn't sure what to do. I wanted to share what I knew or use my knowledge to make a difference but I soon found out, as many others before me have, that you cannot make someone understand higher knowledge, they can only find out for themselves. I came to the same conclusion as you after really thinking about some of Lao Tzu's words: " The ordinary man hates solitude, the master makes use of it."

I have become much more content with sharing knowledge but not expecting results. With learning without forcing information on others. With meditating without feeling the need to discuss the experience.

Although at times it is hard, especially since I have a girlfriend that isn't interested in half of what I am interested in. The lack of understanding in the people that surround me can be frustrating at times, which is mostly why I found this forum.

There is only one thing I really need, and I think most people that have this knowledge need it too. I need a way to remember what I know. It's very ironic but I need a way to keep in mind that I should clear my mind and live in the moment.

I will feel settled and clear, then something will happen, I will be distracted from my knowledge and fall into the illusions of worry and even anger.

How can I stay centered? How can I avoid the wanderings of my mind?

[Eric Orwoll]

To desire a center and to avoid wandering only bears meaning for the individual. Give up individuality and all being is your center, there is nowhere to wander.

All desire, even the desire not to desire, generates a self. Desire implies a separation; to be enlightened is to have knowledge of the ephemerality of separation, of our perceived limits, of our perception itself.

It helps me to reconcile the mandatory experience of limitation, which is due to the nature of our constituent processes, with the reality of oneness by abandoning the concept of free will.

I am a process of thought. I don't control a process of thought. Control/Will implies separation, separation is an illusion.

I try to take pleasure in the experience of unfolding creation, but I don't feel pride or shame for what this chain of thought creates.

[LiquidRainbow]

If we continue to name things beautiful, we will find other things ugly. If we continue to chase after company, other times we will be lonely. If we prefer a certain temperature, we will even feel uncomfortable going outside. The higher we raise our standards and our expectations, the more we will be disappointed and feel that we are lacking. Thus comes the ancient saying, “If you want to be given everything, you must first give everything up.”

I find the last part to be true. But I see nothing wrong with being able to find things beautiful and ugly and just experience them for what they are. I'm happy to have this ability. Let me give you an example for why I think this way.

If you see someone getting killed in front of your eyes for no good reason... Are you proud of your indifference and being able to not call that ugly, now that you've beat your 'desire' to not see things in the abstracts of beautiful and ugly? Glad that you can go with the flow, these lessons are useful. But they are not ultimately helpful to society as a whole.

I'm happy for my high standards and my expectations it's what drives me to teach and try and put in my part into making society better as a whole(no matter how far-fetched this dream of mine is I am still happy for it.)

I ask you to challenge your beliefs and play devil's advocate against yourself and find a more middle ground to stand on, neither high nor low so you have an equal regard for both of their pros and cons.

[NobodyListens2Genius]

I live a very desire free life, I have nothing and want nothing. The people around me don't have the same views as me, and the only point they make is continuing to ask me the question, what about food and shelter?
- Eric,
I completely agree, but I was referring more to getting caught in anger, worry or frustration. "Forgetting the moment" if you will. Forgetting that the world is beyond my control.

-Liquid

I am under the impression that the thing being slaughtered is not ugly but was meant to happen. Although our prejudices and the way I was raised might make me feel otherwise at the time, I agree and I'm usually over idealistic about saving our world and the people in it from their own despair, but I also know trying to control things is doomed for failure. I think the only way we can make a difference is by teaching through example.


- A question for anyone reading

I have considered this for very long and found that if I chase after money then I might as well be saying I am planning to chase after it my whole life. I am not the kind to fall into the same trap I see everyone else in, but I don't know my alternatives?

Do i truly give up all attachment and not even worry about buying food or finding a place of my own and trust that life will guide me? Or is there really no other choice but to conform?

This is not because I am lazy, I am quite the opposite, I am just all too aware that if I depend on money I will be depending on it my whole life. I will end up needing more of it, and hence giving away more of my life for it.

I really want nothing but to meditate, not starve to death, and not freeze.
Is this really so much to ask for? How can I get it without attachment?

I'm going to post this as a question to ask the forum.

[LiquidRainbow]

If this is the route you'd like to take and you'd like to be a non active-participant in our overtly sick society. Then join a monastery of your liking. You can also go the route of doing your societal deeds and take your free time as your enjoyment to do whatever you like. If you enjoy meditation do that, if you enjoy art then do that. Explore and learn there's a lot of ways to enjoy being a human, you don't have to give up attachment, attachment can be enjoyable although at times risky. But sometimes there is a reward at the end. Sometimes there isn't, that is completely up to your perception and point of view solely.

You can also learn how to live on the minimum amount of money needed and still find ways to enjoy things. You can practice your meditation in every action of your life, it doesn't just have to be still thoughtless 'nirvana' to meditate. It seems to me like you've crossed the river. Now you just need to go exploring instead of sitting there saying 'what should I do now?!?!' Just go do something, anything.. Explore the world or explore your mind, or do both. Find enjoyment in the dullness and the activities you have passion for will be that much more fruitful.

[NobodyListens2Genius]

-Liquid

I live in Syndey Australia and there are some nearby monasteries but I am not sure if they would accept me to live with them out of nowhere? If they do then I am very open to this suggestion.

Although, as much as I think the Buddha was spot on. I don't think adhering to the exact principles of a monastic life is necessary. I don't see anything wrong with sex or individual love. I believe I can have both these things without being attached to them or wallowing in loss when they are gone.

How can I be attached and not worried? How could I have a weekly wage and not be dependent on my next payment? What if I don't get it, do I worry and chase after more?

[LiquidRainbow]

Save up some money quit your job and start traveling to rainbow gatherings and music festivals. Learn to live with no money(because you're going to run out eventually) and then learning to live a 'normal' life with detachment will be that much easier. If you choose to go this path you'll find lots of enlightened individuals of various types, no doubt.